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Thread: Game Informer Fallout 3 article scans

  1. #221
    I should set a custom title Still Mildly Glowing

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    Quote Originally Posted by ManiO
    They have completed the story alright, but it looks kind of bad when they can sum it up in less than 5 sentences in it's entirety.
    Not necessarily. That's how film scripts are made as well. First you come up with a quick idea, which when written down is around 2-5 sentences long. Then you make a treatment which is around 1-2 pages long. From that you make a script which usually is ca 90-120 pages long...

  2. #222
    I should set a custom title First time out of the vault

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ausir
    Having a party wasn't really a necessary thing in the first two games, especially in the first one it was just an afterthought that wasn't really initially planned.
    "You'll be able to hire followers who might help you out..." wording kind of bothers me, I don't know why but I have this mental picture of a bunch of guys with sledghammers, swords, and daedric weapons sitting around bars saying (all voiced by the same voice actor) "You need a strong sword arm? For only 200 septims I could help you in the wasteland!"

    I thought the teammates in Fallout 2 were one of the improvements over fallout 1, and some of them (particularly Sulik and Marcus) were pretty interesting. I'm not saying I want KOTOR or BG or anything (which I don't, not by any stretch of the imagination), I just get this bad feeling about how teammates are gonig to be handled in Fallout 3 for some reason.

    I get worse feelings about other stuff, but most of those feelings are actually confirmed by the article

  3. #223
    I should set a custom title Still Mildly Glowing

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tannhauser
    "The Vault of the Future" against "Vault Secure!" which do you prefer?

    From the first concept art released by BS I had a feeling that's it's not a Fallout style. All concepts were too much blue/gray, somehow cold, while old Fallout style was brown, and warm and greatly increasing the irony of the whole situation.

    Really don't like the things I read except the fact that u can catch some radio transmissions with your PipBoy and get quests from there. Other things are not much Fallouty

  4. #224
    I should set a custom title Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

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    Quote Originally Posted by bdweller
    Goddamn, we're screwed?
    What will happen now?
    Yet another 10 years without a game like fallout... I hope Bethesda is screwed too, but gaming "journalists" are just too cocksuckers to stand against them...

  5. #225
    I should set a custom title First time out of the vault

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    Quote Originally Posted by Morbus
    Quote Originally Posted by bdweller
    Goddamn, we're screwed?
    What will happen now?
    Yet another 10 years without a game like fallout... I hope Bethesda is screwed too, but gaming "journalists" are just too cocksuckers to stand against them...
    Gaming history will record this as the day the RPG died forever, to be replaced by first person versions of Diablo.

    Honestly like every goddamn game on the XBOX360 is a first or third person shooter, Bethesda could've gone the Isometric route and cornered the entirety of the RPG market on the consoles

    *by RPG market I refer to classic western style RPGs like Fallout, Planescape, BG, etc

  6. #226
    Lowly new user First time out of the vault

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    About VATS: I don't care if it's turn-based or not. While I'm sure those of you who heard of it dislike Tycho's perspective on things, that's how it works for me too. For me, the setting and the atmosphere were what made Fallout. I understand that for many of you it was a lot more than that, but that's how it is for me. As such, I'm more concerned with stylistic inadequacies than the game not being isometric turn-based.

    Combat was one of Fallout's weakest points. There was nothing wrong with it, mind you, but the rest of the game was ahead of it by leaps and bounds. It was always fun and interesting meeting interesting characters, finding new areas, completing quests (especially if you found a tricky way to do it), and so on. But when the combat screen came up, for me it was never "Oh boy, combat! This'll be great!" Again, it's not like it was unfun either, but combat was only really interesting in terms of getting powerful criticals. Other than that it was mostly trying to pick off the enemies before your party members died.

    I can understand why those of you who really liked Fallout's combat or just want another isometric turn-based game would be really disappointed without it intact. That's fine, but for me, personally - I'm not just a Fallout fan or even just a CRPG fan, I'm a gamer. I play games in every genre - as long as the game is good. So how they implement Fallout's setting and atmosphere doesn't faze me unless it fundamentally changes either one. A straight-up FPS game would do that. This won't. I know that a lot of you point to a game like FOBoS for how drastically changing things (though FOBoS changed more than just combat) can end up in the entire product getting screwed. But there's other examples of the opposite happening. Case in point: Metroid Prime. Took a 2-D platformer and turned it into a 3-D FPS. Retained the style and atmosphere of previous Metroid games and became one of the highest rated games of all time. The initial reaction from Metroid fans was the same as from Fallout fans here - "get your FPS out of my RPG/platformer." So they started calling Metroid Prime an FPA - it's a first-person shooter and you shoot, but it's not Doom or Halo. The same thing's happening here.

    Fallout 3, like Metroid Prime, is in terms of obvious definitions a first-person shooter (or third-person, I suppose, depending on your options). That doesn't mean it's going to completely bastardize the entire series. That's also why they're calling it an Action RPG instead of an FPS. The gameplay choices they're making are, as they said, not going to accommodate twich-based gaming. And although you guys don't like the "Action" part of that title, you should know that the only reason Bethesda is calling it an Action RPG is to reassure you that the atmosphere will be the same (obviously their assurance didn't work, but that's why they did it). We get the opposite from BioShock. Despite it being a first-person game where you shoot things, originally they were touting it as an RPG or an RPG/FPS hybrid. Now they're just calling it a straight-up FPS, because an FPS will sell more. Game hasn't changed. As many of you evidently feel betrayed by Bethesda I'm not sure how much you'll appreciate the gesture, but Bethesda is actually sacrificing sales from the massive FPS gaming market by refusing to give it that label. And the only reason they're refusing to give it that label is to appeal to you.

    On the other hand, the gameplay changes themselves are not being done for you. An isometric turn-based Fallout game would not do well enough it today's market for the amount of work Bethesda puts into their games. If, say, Troika had gotten a hold o the license, it would've been fine. Small dev, can do what it wants. Bethesda needs its games to be big. It's going to make the best Fallout game they can, but they're also going to make it appeal to the biggest market they can while doing so. Although you guys, as hardcore Fallout fans, may not (and evidently do not) appreciate that, know that this game will get wider exposure because of it. And if it maintains Fallout's setting and atmosphere - and don't judge a game that's over a year from release, not counting inevitable delays, from the way a super mutant model looks now or a single weapon they added - I will appreciate it being spread to a wider audience than Fallout or Fallout 2 ever reached.

    As for those of you here, you're not all of Fallout's fans, and you're not a majority. Numbers alone should tell you that. But you're obviously the most dedicated. So rather than sitting here making snide remarks about Orcs and writing off the whole thing as "Oblivion with guns," I'd do whatever I could to try to get Bethesda to implement everything in the way that best matches Fallout's setting and atmosphere. And it would help if you guys seemed genuinely interested in helping Bethesda rather than in bending Bethesda to your will. They're not going to listen to you any more than they already have if you go in with "WE, the FANS of FALLOUT, who KNOW what Fallout TRULY is," you're not going to make a lot of headway. Especially when you start going into "[X] is just not Fallout." You have two options: demand that Fallout 3 is tailored to your exact specifications, or compromise with Bethesda, accept that some things will change, and try to help them make the game as good as it can be.

    So far you've doing the first. If you don't think you have, that's what the perception of this community from anyone on the outside looking in. Either way, it hasn't worked, because Bethesda is going to make the game they want to. They'll listen to fans, but they won't take orders from them. It's the difference between ten pages of bitching about Orcs and making a concerted effort to get in touch with developers and politely telling them that you're concerned because one of the neatest things about Fallout was the style. Without any self-righteous indignation whatsoever. Bethesda will take your opinions into consideration, but if you're dicks about it, past a certain point they're going to say "fuck it." Now might be that point, given that most people who have heard of this outside of these forums seems to think it looks pretty awesome - and yes, I am talking about people who were fans of Fallout, not the random console gamers many of you seem to think are ruining everything. So either help Bethesda, the owners of the IP, make Fallout 3 as good as it can be and give it a chance when it comes out, or keep saying "Fallout 3 will never be Fallout 3" and go back to waiting for a game that will never come out.

    Bethesda's only going to listen to you if you work with it rather than against it. And telling them how much you think all their older games and pet series suck over and over again probably doesn't get you on their good side either, although you can differentiate how you would want certain things to be as opposed to their completely separate fantasy RPGs.

    And now I'm gone, far too pessimistic to think this post will change a single person's mind about any of this.

  7. #227
    I should set a custom title So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdweller
    Goddamn, we're screwed?
    What will happen now?
    I think I'll finally get desperate enough to pay 50$ for the Omega Syndrome.
    Too much to do, not enough time to do it...

    Fallout1: Fatal Damage Mod

  8. #228
    Administrator Brother None's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BB
    As for those of you here, you're not all of Fallout's fans, and you're not a majority. Numbers alone should tell you that.
    Uh, ok, prove it. Where is this enormous majority that disagrees with us hiding? Not on the BGS forums, that's for sure.

    As for your post, perhaps, but wouldn't it then be nice if Bethesda shows they're willing to work with us? After Oblivion, nobody should have any reason to trust much of anything they promise, so why should we work towards them, rather than vice versa?

  9. #229
    I should set a custom title So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

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    Quote Originally Posted by yossa
    Quote Originally Posted by ManiO
    They have completed the story alright, but it looks kind of bad when they can sum it up in less than 5 sentences in it's entirety.
    Your vault needs a new waterchip, so you go and find it. Turns out there are supermutants roaming the wasteland and your overseer commands you to find their source and stop them. All in all you save the world.
    You forgot perhaps the most important part, the ending. "Hey you're back, you saved us thanks, now get the fuck out."

    Also, damn it with guys like BB who just don't take a fucking hint. You're not saying anything new and everything you've said is either preference or has already been shot down in the past.

  10. #230
    Still kind of new First time out of the vault

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    Well, NMA has perhaps 500 active posters (and that's being generous). Hardly a significant number by any stretch of imagination. Also considering the attitudes here, it's hardly surprising the dissenting Fallout fans have long since left these forums. As for Bethesda forums, I imagine the most of the people who loathe Fallout 3 are actually DaC/NMA posters. On other gaming forums the reactions have been much more positive.

  11. #231
    I should set a custom title So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fallacy
    Well, NMA has perhaps 500 active posters (and that's being generous). Hardly a significant number by any stretch of imagination. Also considering the attitudes here, it's hardly surprising the dissenting Fallout fans have long since left these forums. As for Bethesda forums, I imagine the most of the people who loathe Fallout 3 are actually DaC/NMA posters. On other gaming forums over the internet the reactions have been much more positive.
    On other forums? You see maybe five to ten posters (and that's being generous) post in complete agreement and *assume* they're the majority? For all you know, they're the same posters cross-posting on other forums how much they love Beth. Practice what you preach.

    Not to mention this site has the largest compilation of Fallout material I've seen anywhere.

  12. #232
    I should set a custom title Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brother None
    The foreign language NMA sites were never on the fansite list, besides, all the foreign language NMA sites have the scans on the frontpage too.

    PS: they just removed the NMA link from my sig and posts too. Looks like we're on a blacklist now. Gonna ask a mod.
    How flippin outrageous... What the hell is wrong with Beth? Afraid of bad press? Then perhaps you should have created a product that generated positive press.

    Are they indicating that not everyone reads Game Informer Mag? This is available to the public, how does talking about a publicly available article result in being blacklisted by Bethesda?

    What kind of crap is this... I'm very disappointed in Bethesda after this cheap low life move.
    "When it comes to Fallout fans, ignorance, stupidity and arrogance is bad combination, because this is a community that has all of those. Since I've already opened the door there, they're loathsome human beings, who I hope really get a horrible disease and die." -Alan "Delsyn" Rausch

  13. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by BB
    About VATS: I don't care if it's turn-based or not. While I'm sure those of you who heard of it dislike Tycho's perspective on things, that's how it works for me too. For me, the setting and the atmosphere were what made Fallout. I understand that for many of you it was a lot more than that, but that's how it is for me. As such, I'm more concerned with stylistic inadequacies than the game not being isometric turn-based.

    Combat was one of Fallout's weakest points. There was nothing wrong with it, mind you, but the rest of the game was ahead of it by leaps and bounds. It was always fun and interesting meeting interesting characters, finding new areas, completing quests (especially if you found a tricky way to do it), and so on. But when the combat screen came up, for me it was never "Oh boy, combat! This'll be great!" Again, it's not like it was unfun either, but combat was only really interesting in terms of getting powerful criticals. Other than that it was mostly trying to pick off the enemies before your party members died.

    I can understand why those of you who really liked Fallout's combat or just want another isometric turn-based game would be really disappointed without it intact. That's fine, but for me, personally - I'm not just a Fallout fan or even just a CRPG fan, I'm a gamer. I play games in every genre - as long as the game is good. So how they implement Fallout's setting and atmosphere doesn't faze me unless it fundamentally changes either one. A straight-up FPS game would do that. This won't. I know that a lot of you point to a game like FOBoS for how drastically changing things (though FOBoS changed more than just combat) can end up in the entire product getting screwed. But there's other examples of the opposite happening. Case in point: Metroid Prime. Took a 2-D platformer and turned it into a 3-D FPS. Retained the style and atmosphere of previous Metroid games and became one of the highest rated games of all time. The initial reaction from Metroid fans was the same as from Fallout fans here - "get your FPS out of my RPG/platformer." So they started calling Metroid Prime an FPA - it's a first-person shooter and you shoot, but it's not Doom or Halo. The same thing's happening here.

    Fallout 3, like Metroid Prime, is in terms of obvious definitions a first-person shooter (or third-person, I suppose, depending on your options). That doesn't mean it's going to completely bastardize the entire series. That's also why they're calling it an Action RPG instead of an FPS. The gameplay choices they're making are, as they said, not going to accommodate twich-based gaming. And although you guys don't like the "Action" part of that title, you should know that the only reason Bethesda is calling it an Action RPG is to reassure you that the atmosphere will be the same (obviously their assurance didn't work, but that's why they did it). We get the opposite from BioShock. Despite it being a first-person game where you shoot things, originally they were touting it as an RPG or an RPG/FPS hybrid. Now they're just calling it a straight-up FPS, because an FPS will sell more. Game hasn't changed. As many of you evidently feel betrayed by Bethesda I'm not sure how much you'll appreciate the gesture, but Bethesda is actually sacrificing sales from the massive FPS gaming market by refusing to give it that label. And the only reason they're refusing to give it that label is to appeal to you.
    Yeah, neat, you think Fallout is just the setting. Good for you. But unfortunately, this is bullshit. Fallout's combat and viewpoint are both part of the central design of the game. Removing either is *by definition* a bastardization of the series.

    Quote Originally Posted by BB
    On the other hand, the gameplay changes themselves are not being done for you. An isometric turn-based Fallout game would not do well enough it today's market for the amount of work Bethesda puts into their games.
    *yawn*
    Why does every troll make this baseless assumption? 'They can't do isometric turn-based because that doesn't sell'
    Oh really? And *yet another* first-person, real-time game in an already way overcrowded market would?
    Quote Originally Posted by BB
    If, say, Troika had gotten a hold o the license, it would've been fine. Small dev, can do what it wants. Bethesda needs its games to be big. It's going to make the best Fallout game they can, but they're also going to make it appeal to the biggest market they can while doing so. Although you guys, as hardcore Fallout fans, may not (and evidently do not) appreciate that, know that this game will get wider exposure because of it. And if it maintains Fallout's setting and atmosphere - and don't judge a game that's over a year from release, not counting inevitable delays, from the way a super mutant model looks now or a single weapon they added - I will appreciate it being spread to a wider audience than Fallout or Fallout 2 ever reached.
    So, if Bethesda 'needs' to appeal to a market as big as possible, why did they spend a couple of millions of dollars on a name that only appears to a niche of that big market, and then also abuse that name by butchering the original design and hence not using the established fanbase of the game?

    Quote Originally Posted by BB
    As for those of you here, you're not all of Fallout's fans, and you're not a majority. Numbers alone should tell you that. But you're obviously the most dedicated. So rather than sitting here making snide remarks about Orcs and writing off the whole thing as "Oblivion with guns," I'd do whatever I could to try to get Bethesda to implement everything in the way that best matches Fallout's setting and atmosphere.
    Oh, right, like we haven't stated and suggested over and over and over and over again what the core design of Fallout is?
    Give me a fucking break. If Bethesda breaks with the core design, they do that willingly and knowingly. Unless they're completely blind and never read anything Fallout fans post, which is provably untrue.

    Here's a small fact: they know what Fallout's basic design is, but they still choose to ignore that design. We've actually proven objectively that.
    Listening to fans my ass.

    Quote Originally Posted by BB
    And it would help if you guys seemed genuinely interested in helping Bethesda rather than in bending Bethesda to your will. They're not going to listen to you any more than they already have if you go in with "WE, the FANS of FALLOUT, who KNOW what Fallout TRULY is," you're not going to make a lot of headway. Especially when you start going into "[X] is just not Fallout." You have two options: demand that Fallout 3 is tailored to your exact specifications, or compromise with Bethesda, accept that some things will change, and try to help them make the game as good as it can be.

    So far you've doing the first. If you don't think you have, that's what the perception of this community from anyone on the outside looking in. Either way, it hasn't worked, because Bethesda is going to make the game they want to. They'll listen to fans, but they won't take orders from them. It's the difference between ten pages of bitching about Orcs and making a concerted effort to get in touch with developers and politely telling them that you're concerned because one of the neatest things about Fallout was the style. Without any self-righteous indignation whatsoever. Bethesda will take your opinions into consideration, but if you're dicks about it, past a certain point they're going to say "fuck it." Now might be that point, given that most people who have heard of this outside of these forums seems to think it looks pretty awesome - and yes, I am talking about people who were fans of Fallout, not the random console gamers many of you seem to think are ruining everything. So either help Bethesda, the owners of the IP, make Fallout 3 as good as it can be and give it a chance when it comes out, or keep saying "Fallout 3 will never be Fallout 3" and go back to waiting for a game that will never come out.

    Bethesda's only going to listen to you if you work with it rather than against it. And telling them how much you think all their older games and pet series suck over and over again probably doesn't get you on their good side either, although you can differentiate how you would want certain things to be as opposed to their completely separate fantasy RPGs.
    Oh, right, so now we need to be friendly and co-operate with a company that has shown pretty much no interest in either listening to fans, communicating with fans or, in fact, having anything to do with said fans?
    Pft.

    Yes, we know what a real Fallout game is and needs. That's because this community has existed for over 10 years and has collected a wealth of information on and analysis of those games. Bethesda's developers also know this. They've also had access to this information. Yet they've willingly chosen to ignore it, knowing for a fact that the fans that have supported this series and have kept it alive for years would not be even remotely happy with this.

  14. #234
    Administrator Brother None's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fallacy
    Well, NMA has perhaps 500 active posters (and that's being generous). Hardly a significant number by any stretch of imagination. Also considering the attitudes here, it's hardly surprising the dissenting Fallout fans have long since left these forums. As for Bethesda forums, I imagine the most of the people who loathe Fallout 3 are actually DaC/NMA posters. On other gaming forums the reactions have been much more positive.
    ...If we have only 500 active posters, how are we able to take over other gaming forums, like the Bethesda forums, like the Gamespot forums?

  15. #235
    Lowly new user First time out of the vault

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brother None
    Quote Originally Posted by BB
    As for those of you here, you're not all of Fallout's fans, and you're not a majority. Numbers alone should tell you that.
    Uh, ok, prove it. Where is this enormous majority that disagrees with us hiding? Not on the BGS forums, that's for sure.
    Not disagreeing with you, necessarily. Many of them may agree with you. Many of them may not. But even if only a quarter of the people who bought Fallout really liked it - Fallout sold at least 100,000 copies, though I don't know the exact number - you would not have the majority of the fans on these forums, even if everyone registered on these forums absolutely hated everything about the scans down to the paper they were printed on.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother None
    As for your post, perhaps, but wouldn't it then be nice if Bethesda shows they're willing to work with us? After Oblivion, nobody should have any reason to trust much of anything they promise, so why should we work towards them, rather than vice versa?
    This is something you'll have to figure out on your own. Your site has a chance of getting into contact with the devs; I do not. Gone for real now though. The forward guard of the Ignorance Brigade's showing up (not you, you're A-OK with me).

  16. #236
    I should set a custom title Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maphusio
    Quote Originally Posted by Brother None
    The foreign language NMA sites were never on the fansite list, besides, all the foreign language NMA sites have the scans on the frontpage too.

    PS: they just removed the NMA link from my sig and posts too. Looks like we're on a blacklist now. Gonna ask a mod.
    How flippin outrageous... What the hell is wrong with Beth? Afraid of bad press? Then perhaps you should have created a product that generated positive press.

    Are they indicating that not everyone reads Game Informer Mag? This is available to the public, how does talking about a publicly available article result in being blacklisted by Bethesda?

    What kind of crap is this... I'm very disappointed in Bethesda after this cheap low life move.
    I do believe it's because the mag scans posted here are illegal


    Lahmende ahnung wird nackt.
    Entblosste angst wird still.

  17. #237
    Administrator Brother None's Avatar
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    They are? Fair Use, BABY!

    They're not illegal until someone tells us they are. But they are again BGS forum rules, and that's fair, it's their forum.

  18. #238
    I should set a custom title Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Madbringer

    I do believe it's because the mag scans posted here are illegal
    How are they illegal? Why did they not give warning if that was the case? Or did they just assume we would know better? Or is there really something more to it than any of the above?

    Kharn anyone say one way or the other over there on this? Viva La Revolution?
    "When it comes to Fallout fans, ignorance, stupidity and arrogance is bad combination, because this is a community that has all of those. Since I've already opened the door there, they're loathsome human beings, who I hope really get a horrible disease and die." -Alan "Delsyn" Rausch

  19. #239
    I should set a custom title It Wandered In From the Wastes

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    Quote Originally Posted by Madbringer
    I do believe it's because the mag scans posted here are illegal
    100% true, posting mag scans is illegal.

  20. #240
    I should set a custom title Mildly Dipped

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    Im also concerned about the lack of eye/groin shots. Or perhaps I mean, the text that went along with it when you blinded someone. I'd love a return of the descriptive text, with the little jokes and stuff that was in it. The text wasn't there purely because they couldn't show you in the game, it added its own flavour to the world.

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