Ok. This is turning into one abomination of a discussion, and deciphering what points are being made is getting a real hassle. I'm going to do my best to make things orderly, but if it turns into a clusterfuck again I am going to stop beating the proverbial dead horse. 1. Does House have popular support? Having 'popular support' means the general public supports your rule. Apart from perhaps a handful of Chairmen and White Gloves (essentially the elite of Vegas and both factions that have their own beef with House), people generally disapprove of Mr. House's rule, especially anywhere outside the Strip. Almost universally people express they're happy when House is dead. 1a. Why does this matter? Because if House's underlings do not want to be ruled by him, he's a tyrant and a bad leader of Vegas. 2. Is House a narcissist? I guess we've agreed on this point; Yes. 2a. Why does this matter? Wiki: "driven by unyielding arrogance, self-absorption, and a personal egotistic need for power and admiration". This pretty much sums up Mr. House. Narcissism is an inherently destructive trait in a leader, because to a narcissist ego is more important than the well-being of his underlings. The Mojave is a clear example of this. He willfully excludes people from wealth and energy to further his own ambitions, regardless of what his underlings want. House wants to go to the stars, but do any of the inhabitants of the Mojave care about that? One person's ambitions is not a sufficient basis to rule a nation. 3. Is Vegas a positive thing for the Mojave? Okay, I do not think we are going to agree on this, but to clarify my stance: I do not think the pros outweigh the cons in this situation. I can see how Vegas facilitates some trade, but for every tradepost along the I-15 there's also a slum in New Vegas that's filled with chem addicts, thugs and beggars. 3a. Why does this matter? When talking of House's post-war achievements people often point to Vegas. I do not see Vegas as a positive thing for the Mojave, so I do not see it as a valid reason why House should be allowed to rule Vegas/the Mojave. In fact, I see it as a reason why House shouldn't rule Vegas or the Mojave. 4. What does megalomania mean? Wiki: "A psychopathological condition characterized by delusional fantasies of wealth, power, or omnipotence." Considering House's huge ambitions regarding mankind, I'd say this applies. 5. Does Caesar have popular support? Ofcourse, he does. The fact that his legionaries are "conditioned" doesn't change that. Everybody is "conditioned" by their culture, their upbringing, their past, etc. If they support him, they support him. That's that. 5a. does Caesar have popular support in the Mojave? No, but the subject of this discussion in Mr. House, not Caesar or his Legion. 6. Does House end up ruling more than Vegas? Ok, this means going into speculation, but I'll say this: If we're going by the ending slides, any of House's ambitions should be kept out of the discussion. If you do want to use Mr. House's ambitions as part of your argument, we have to assume he extends his rule beyond Vegas and the Mojave, considering he wants to revive the high-tech sectors and put people into space. He may even have to conquer all of the U.S. to furfill those ambitions. So, what's it going to be? 7. Did Robert House help the U.S. military develop weapons? The short answer is yes, but the details of what he developed are unclear. Could it have been rockets? I argue yes, because he owned REPCONN. But I admit this is speculation on my part and I think we should keep this out of the discussion. Please try to stick to these points as much as possible (unless I missed something important). If we can keep things orderly, it just makes the discussion a lot more pleasant.