Benny should have been the final Boss

Discussion in 'Fallout: New Vegas Discussion' started by NevadaCourier2281, Dec 18, 2021.

  1. NevadaCourier2281

    NevadaCourier2281 First time out of the vault

    31
    Dec 14, 2021
    I feel like as if Obsidian crammed to much into one game.

    As for as I know Van Buren was originally about a guy escaping prison, evading the mobile walking prison and stopping Presper for killing everyone with his purification experiment on the wasteland.

    The second part featured you go to Denver and meet the dogs. With the ending being NCR and BoS fighting for Hoover Dam. I guess every other location and character from New Vegas would have appeared too. Maybe we would have fought in the Helios One battle.

    Caesar's Legion and Daughters of Hecate have a conflict that was going to be saved for Fallout 4. The sequel to Van Buren.

    I know the isometric games took place in numerous cities and states while New Vegas had to be confined to one city world space and a few small dlc like Fallout 3.

    For Fallout: New Vegas so much content was cut. The Hoover Dam battle was a letdown, because it was never a battle over a specific location, it was an all out war in the Mojave. With battles in the Strip, Novac, Forlorn Hope, Freeside and other places that I do not remmember. Instead of the huge GTA size'd settlements of the Strip and Freeside we got a couple short roads and a couple buildings. Also no vehicles. Fallout 2 had vehicles.

    It seems as though New Vegas itself is an original story. At least the platinum chip, Benny and Mr. House plot. Everything else like Caesar's Legion, Hoover Dam and NCR lore were just shoehorned into the game off of Van Buren's drafts.

    Did the devs experience development issues? I feel like one half of the dev team wanted an original story with Benny, The Courier and Mr. House, while the other half of the dev team wanted to just make Van Buren. Two different plotlines. So they just compromised and combined two things together. You don't even need to encounter Benny for the NCR plotline which is unnerving to say the least. It's as if the game baited you and tricked you into playing a different game, (weird transition from Benny to Hoover dam)

    The plot is just two seperate stories. One that's personal and connected to you specifically. While the other is just different factions using you as a tool to win Hoover Dam. You feel like a side character in the Hoover Dam plotline.

    I just wish the devs made up their mind. They should have either made Van Buren with Caesar's Legion and the Hoover Dam battle, or they should have made the Courier's revenge on Benny and the platinum chip.

    I personally prefer the Benny storyline, because this is the game that I sat down to play. Not 3/4 of the cut Van Buren game. Because if I sat down to play Van Buren, I would not play as the Courier nor would the platinum chip or Benny exist.

    Atleast for the Van Buren fans, they could have made the Hoover Dam Battle a side quest and added the Helios One battle as well. Or they could have made it DLC. The DLC or sidequest could have been this huge war like in Broken Steel that would span days or even weeks. Where you would be deployed in different parts of the Mojave, from Freeside, to the Strip, to Novac to Nelson etc.

    My idea for Benny was making him actually successful in utilising the platinum chip. Have him hire his own private army like the way Gammorah did. Make him become the terror of Vegas and the Mojave. Make him turn everyone against you. Frame you. Idk.

    They should have added in cars at least. That's not a lot to ask for. Eventhough a game like Fallout is expected to have vehicles. Maybe if the devs had a better engine to work off of and more time. Lack of publisher funding.

    A car chase throughout New Vegas, as a massive city settlement after Benny would have been a satisfying ending.

    By the way I have complaints for the wasteland itself too. Where is area 51? Where are all the counties? Villages? Bunkers? Towers? Anything?
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2021
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 2
  2. Post-War Tribal

    Post-War Tribal Chief Owslandr

    515
    Nov 8, 2018
    If Obsidian had more than 18 months to develop the game then we'd have more content. Check out Triangle Citys videos on the cut content.
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 3
  3. NevadaCourier2281

    NevadaCourier2281 First time out of the vault

    31
    Dec 14, 2021
    It's a great game, it just feels incomplete.
     
  4. Post-War Tribal

    Post-War Tribal Chief Owslandr

    515
    Nov 8, 2018
    Because it is incomplete.
     
  5. Eshanas

    Eshanas Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    819
    Jul 6, 2016
    A car case? For...Benny? As the final boss? No no no. The whole thing is, Benny isn't the hot shot he thinks he is. He's nothing on the big scale. There's a whole war going on.

    He can only trick mercs, randoms, and those under his direct employ. He's nothing compared to Oliver, Lanius, House, Caesar.

    He's a middle manager getting too big for his britches. His ambition has him undercut House and ruin a dozen lives just to get a chip.

    I feel like it's not a big juxtaposition that we go from Benny to the greater war? We're being sucked into it, and Benny was the thing that tied you down to the land, and allowed you to garner a reputation.

    Let's muse on what would had happened if Benny didn't do anything.

    You go to house, deliver the Chip. Probably would had turned back around Sloan and go around the other way - maybe had had a brush with the Legion in Nipton? House says thank you, gives you your caps, you might stay in Vegas or get out of town due to the war.

    The only way the 'game' would start then would be if another faction wanted your services. But then you're just a mailman. The Benny story turns you into a little legend, you got experience and reputation under your belt. You helped people, you killed people.

    Without Benny, the Courier doesn't have that. Sure Ulysses is still out there mad about the Divide, but that's about it. The game, to me, would feel a lot less coherent without Benny, or too pigeonholed to focus on Benny up to the last moment while there's a whole war going on.
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 6
  6. Iprovidelittlepianos

    Iprovidelittlepianos Mildly Dipped

    569
    May 12, 2020
    I’m pretty sure there was never going to be a battle for Hoover dam in Van Buren, and if there was, it would have to involve the Trogs. Also I’m pretty sure Vegas was not to appear in Van Buren, nor most of the locations from Fallout: NV. The only character from Van Buren that appears in NV is Joshua Graham, and even then he is radically different from the way he was to be portrayed in Van Buren.
     
  7. NevadaCourier2281

    NevadaCourier2281 First time out of the vault

    31
    Dec 14, 2021
    In Van Buren we were supposed to be given multiple cities to explore in Nevada, Arizona and Colorado. I already stated that New Vegas is half an orginal game and half a Van Buren game. The city New Vegas itself is original.

    Julie Farkas is from Van Buren. Arcade Gannon is from Van Buren. Caesar's Legion is from Van Buren. Read the wiki. The Hoover Dam battle is from Van Buren.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2021
  8. NevadaCourier2281

    NevadaCourier2281 First time out of the vault

    31
    Dec 14, 2021
    So? The Master in Fallout was never a head on fighter but more of a mastermind. I know people really liked Frank Horrigan but he was not the main villain. The Enclave leaders were. He was just their soldier who took orders from them. The same can be said for Lanius.

    In New Vegas there is no NCR boss battle. The only boss battle we get was Lanius. And even he took orders from Caesar, who himself was useless in a fight.

    By Benny being "the final boss" I mean him being the main antagonist. He himself is no good in a fight but he is a very influential figure. Essentially the direction of the game was more crime than warfare.

    Essentially the first part of New Vegas is like a New Reno like standalone game. With the mafia and crime being in the casinos, while Freeside suffers from poverty.

    The idea I had in mind was fighting his securitrons and armed bodyguards and private armies using futuristic tech. Helios One was overshadowed. Maybe tie in the Archimedes II weapon and nuclear silos into the main game.

    ou do realize the Courier should be drafted into the NCR military? The NCR has conscriptions and if they were going to war the Courier would be drafted.

    But there is no fun in making a game about a soldier in the NCR military. As you are restricted to where the NCR deploys you. Who wants to play Fallout: Call of Duty? The Frontier "cough," "cough," anyone?

    Neither of the leaders you listed are any different. Oliver forces the NCR to fight his wars for him (well for the oligarchs and the NCR deep state.) Caesars sends his men to die while he sits on his throne. Mr. House is a dead man with digital immortality, and relies on his securitrons and human errand boys (Courier, Benny etc.) Lanius is not even a leader. He is Caesar's legate. He does not even fight alongiside you in the Hoover Dsm battle. He only fights you when you corner him and defeat most of the Legion.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2021
  9. Iprovidelittlepianos

    Iprovidelittlepianos Mildly Dipped

    569
    May 12, 2020
    Take it easy with the quadruple posts, that’s something the mods don’t take kindly to around here. Just edit your post if you have something to add
     
  10. laclongquan

    laclongquan Boned Hunter of Sister

    606
    Jan 11, 2008
    On the specific issue of Benny

    I feel that chum succeed all goals set out for him. The female couriers also has three specific ways to deal with him: kill him, sleep with him, and release him later. Which is more than enough for a intermediate boss~

    Benny not being last stage boss is nothing special because Caesar doesnt even be one. So no great loss
    ---------------
    OTOH, I keep expecting a FoA character like Emily jumping out to be the brain behind Yes Man, and Yes Man ending as YOU being the manipulated doll on stage (as you replaced Benny to be that dummy)
    ----------------
    To be honest, if there's more last boss in the final Battle of Hoover Dam, I expect Vulpes resurfacing (and the one you killed is his dummy)
     
  11. Post-War Tribal

    Post-War Tribal Chief Owslandr

    515
    Nov 8, 2018
    Depends. My courier isn't a NCR citizen.
     
  12. NevadaCourier2281

    NevadaCourier2281 First time out of the vault

    31
    Dec 14, 2021
    Why is that?

    Does not matter. The NCR would conscript Mojave dwellers anyway. They are annexing Vegas after all.

    FoA are good people anyways. They were going to originally play a main role in the game. You would tell Julie Fawkes too keep order in Freeside with the Yes Man ending, and recieve postgame ending quests as well.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2021
  13. Post-War Tribal

    Post-War Tribal Chief Owslandr

    515
    Nov 8, 2018
    Why would he? Who says my courier is a Mojave citizen? The foa need more grey areas they're too morally good. Also Yes Man is updating himself to act more independently at the independent ending and may give the Courier the Oliver-flew-over-the-dam treatment when done.
     
  14. NevadaCourier2281

    NevadaCourier2281 First time out of the vault

    31
    Dec 14, 2021
    The Courier came from the west. Confirmed via Lonesome Road. He worked in Primm at the Mojave express.

    Yes Man and FoA conspiracies are your own headcannon. The game is written as east bad, west good, and Vegas is too materialistic.
     
  15. Post-War Tribal

    Post-War Tribal Chief Owslandr

    515
    Nov 8, 2018
    Only thing it confirmed was that the courier had traveled the west. Ulysses nor the Courier never explicitly said they were born in the west.
     
  16. NevadaCourier2281

    NevadaCourier2281 First time out of the vault

    31
    Dec 14, 2021
    The NCR would have recruited you whether you wanted it or not. The NCR would have conscripted you. Since they annexed New Vegas.
     
  17. Post-War Tribal

    Post-War Tribal Chief Owslandr

    515
    Nov 8, 2018
    Well they don't do they? I don't recall any Mojave residents reffered to as being conscripted in NV?
     
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 1
  18. NevadaCourier2281

    NevadaCourier2281 First time out of the vault

    31
    Dec 14, 2021
    No. They get killed if they refuse annexation. The Kings are a good example. Everyone in the Mojave who is not NCR are raiders and gangs.

    You never really get to see Mojave civilians. But during the Hoover Dam battle, everyone in Vegas and the Mojave took part in the war.
     
  19. Post-War Tribal

    Post-War Tribal Chief Owslandr

    515
    Nov 8, 2018
    • [Rad] [Rad] x 3
  20. NevadaCourier2281

    NevadaCourier2281 First time out of the vault

    31
    Dec 14, 2021