Fallout 4 goes Skyrim with infinite re-releases

[The Dutch Ghost]

I think you just put into words why Fallout is so appealing to me as well. That’s exactly it. Thank you.

It really just randomly came in my mind when I was trying to think of what made the first Fallout so special for me other than the setting. I had played console RPGs before I played Fallout but I was always a little wary of touching a PC RPG as it seemed to involve so much numbers and understanding of RPG rules that I thought that it would be very complex for someone who usually only played platform games, FPS games, and point'n click adventure games. That every build that I would make would very bad.

It may surprise you how long it took for me to find out that I had actually earned experience points that allowed me to improve skills.
I still needed an explanation guide from others how to put together the most balanced builds that allows the use of all action points. (my first build only had seven)

I am probably still hesitant to play any Goldbox games.

 

[Takashi]

Seeing as it's a Free update, it's not really milking it. If they were charging for the update, that would be milking it.

 

[SquidWard]

Seeing as it's a Free update, it's not really milking it. If they were charging for the update, that would be milking it.

That's a fair assessment. And that'd be shitty of them to do. Though it wouldn't shock me seeing how they've rereleased Skyrim and added Creation Club to Skyrim and Fallout 4 as well.

 

[Verevoof]

Seeing as it's a Free update, it's not really milking it. If they were charging for the update, that would be milking it.

I didn’t realize it was free. Maybe they listened to the fans questioning the Skyrim rerelease how many years after the initial release.

 

[Mirin Lurker]

Free for now...

 

[Zentropy]

Signed up just to reply; I'm a big fan of the original Fallout games, more Fallout 1 than 2 but I digress... I'm also a huge fan of Bethesda.

Now, despite all the hate they get, Bethesda has released one *bad* game in the last 20+ years: Fallout 76.

Developers, unfortunately, are also businesses, and as such must operate at to gain revenue. Most developers rush games and make a shit ton of half assed sequels, like Assasin's Creed, or Call of Duty.

Bethesda, on the other hand, takes pride in their work, and makes timeless video games, and continues to support them for long periods of time. This process takes more *time* so they need to get money from *somewhere* inbetween those releases. This is where the re-releases come in.

Frankly, I prefer their current model. Now in the case of Fallout, I would love for Bethesda to let Obsidian make a Fallout game on FO4's engine ala New Vegas, but Obsidian just said that isn't gonna' happen because they are too busy.

So if you want Bethesda to start half assing games, or letting other developers touch Fallout so you can get it sooner? Fine. But me personally? I would rather they keep updating Fallout 4, and that modders continue to create new content for it while Bethesda makes Starfield, then Elder Scrolls 6, *then* Fallout 5 somewhere around 2028-2029, barring Obsidian making a title on license in a few years.

 

[Mirin Lurker]

Is this bait?

 

[TheKingofVault14]

Is this bait?

I was thinking the same thing dude, it seems awfully like bait to me!

BTW, where do I dislike that comment though?

 

[JoacoN]

Signed up just to reply; I'm a big fan of the original Fallout games, more Fallout 1 than 2 but I digress... I'm also a huge fan of Bethesda.

Now, despite all the hate they get, Bethesda has released one *bad* game in the last 20+ years: Fallout 76.

Developers, unfortunately, are also businesses, and as such must operate at to gain revenue. Most developers rush games and make a shit ton of half assed sequels, like Assasin's Creed, or Call of Duty.

Bethesda, on the other hand, takes pride in their work, and makes timeless video games, and continues to support them for long periods of time. This process takes more *time* so they need to get money from *somewhere* inbetween those releases. This is where the re-releases come in.

Frankly, I prefer their current model. Now in the case of Fallout, I would love for Bethesda to let Obsidian make a Fallout game on FO4's engine ala New Vegas, but Obsidian just said that isn't gonna' happen because they are too busy.

So if you want Bethesda to start half assing games, or letting other developers touch Fallout so you can get it sooner? Fine. But me personally? I would rather they keep updating Fallout 4, and that modders continue to create new content for it while Bethesda makes Starfield, then Elder Scrolls 6, *then* Fallout 5 somewhere around 2028-2029, barring Obsidian making a title on license in a few years.

"One bad game"

 

[JoacoN]

Bruh

 

[Norzan]

Most developers rush games and make a shit ton of half assed sequels, like Assasin's Creed, or Call of Duty.

Yeah, unlike Bethesda games which always come out great and not completely buggy and broken even years later, with some bugs transferring to new releases that were fixed in the previous game (and a lot of the bugs fixed by modders).

 

[Verevoof]

Bethesda games are not optimized to play on PC.

 

[Norzan]

They are buggy and broken regardless of platform. So to say that Bethesda doesn't release half assed games is flat out wrong.

 

[Zentropy]

The Creation Engine is a masterpiece; I'll quote someone who posted this on Reddit in one of my threads a few days ago

"It's insane how well they stream exterior cell data, with physics, AI, cell data persistence and all (compared for example to Assassin's creed or Witcher or GTA where anything outside the render area might as well not exist), and the incredibly handy tools that the engine has that allow for swift content creation.

I also mentioned it before, but I'll say it again: BGS have completely remade Havok to be highly optimized with custom layers and classes they inserted into it. It's partly why Fallout 4 runs at all"

The scope of Bethesda games and the intricacy of the worlds and the AI is in a totally different league. There is no other developer that actually has AI with schedules that feed themselves, go to sleep at night, and carry out task and travel in real time. Bethesda's worlds are fully interactive, living and breathing.

And the reason they make the most modded games ever is due to the intricacy of the world they created and the powerful tool sets they have developed and released for the community to create mods with.

I mean, name a single RPG that has half the depth of OBLIVION when it comes to the world and AI. Sure their games come with a few bugs at first, but they are still the best at what they do, and they spend YEARS developing each title, rather than releasing multiple titles on an identical engine for money.

I would rather a developer shoot for the moon and fall short. You guys better pray that Bethesda continues to stick to the same formula, because it will be a sad day if they ever fold, and I guarantee you'll all realize what you had, after the fact, if they ever do go under.

 

[Zentropy]

Like, I understand wanting Fallout to have CRPG releases with an Isometric Perspective, or wanting Obsidian to be involved in standalone releases or the mainline series; that would be an awesome addition to the series, and has already happened in the form of New Vegas.

But out of every other developer on the planet, there is no other team that could do justice to Fallout, or give us quality, uncompromising games. Does Bethesda take forever to release mainline games? Yes, and if you aren't a fan of *all* of their mainline series, it is unbearable, but if you try to just accept that Elder Scrolls, Starfield, and Fallout are essentially evolutions of each other at this point, then it becomes easy to accept Bethesda's method, and to just look forward to Starfield.

I'm pretty sure most of us have spent multiple hundreds of hours playing Fallout 4 and Skyrim, and Starfield will be an evolution of both of those games, and a preview of what we have to look forward to when Fallout 5 eventually comes out.

 

[Norzan]

The scope of Bethesda games and the intricacy of the worlds and the AI is in a totally different league.

Not really, if anything they are narrow in scope. Depth of a puddle basically.

There is no other developer that actually has AI with schedules that feed themselves, go to sleep at night, and carry out task and travel in real time.

Yeah, and it causes cities to be empty because they have to waste development on these AI packages instead of making the cities actually feel populated.

I'll take Novigrad from Witcher 3 over any city from Bethesda games since Oblivion.

You guys better pray that Bethesda continues to stick to the same formula, because it will be a sad day if they ever fold, and I guarantee you'll all realize what you had, after the fact, if they ever do go under.

Me personally i'll be glad when they fold. Releasing nothing but crap since Oblivion and genuinely making the AAA mainstream worse because the copycats come running trying to emulate their bad design due to their games selling a ton. All the crap Far Cry sequels and Assassin Creed sequels.

And really, you are aware that some people hate that formula and yet you claim they will miss Bethesda if it folds because that would mean losing that formula. That's the weirdest logic i have read today.

I'm pretty sure most of us have spent multiple hundreds of hours playing Fallout 4 and Skyrim

I sure as shit haven't and i'm glad i didn't. Abysmal, broken games filled with some of the worst writing in fiction.

Cool that you enjoy them, but you aren't gonna convince me of anything if that's your plan.

and Starfield will be an evolution of both of those games

So, bad.

and a preview of what we have to look forward to when Fallout 5 eventually comes out

So, bad.

This is bait, but i like to every now and then expel my bile that i have for Bethesda games. Makes me feel good and i don't care if it's a waste of time.

@TorontoReign Don't forget to blame me for this one going away when they eventually do. If they do stick around and become a productive member of the forum, that's cool.

 

[Mirin Lurker]

The Creation Engine is a masterpiece.

Ah yes this is bait. Its a barely held together zombie-Morrowind engine.

 

[Mirin Lurker]

And I'll say this, as someone who adores Oblivion and has spent more time playing it than probably every other game combined, all the work that went into the AI and schedule etc, was a complete waste. It really doesn't add that much to the experience and in many ways detracts from it. They were far too ambitious with the ai and npcs and the game is worse for it. The world is mediocre, buggy and uncanny. They've slowly dialed it back because they realized no one cares if Herminnia Cinna goes on vacation once a month. That's development time they couldve spent adding actual content to the game.

 

[Zentropy]

Norzan, you mention other games trying to copy Bethesda... uh which ones? No developer has the technological capability to copy a Bethesda game. There hasn't been a single game even remotely resembling a Bethesda game by another developer.

Their worlds are the only living virtual worlds that have ever been made; I tried to play The Witcher 3 and it's just... dead. The characters stand in one place, and repeat the same line over and over again. They don't eat, sleep, they're like paintings with voice lines. I'm the type of player who has to believe in a world to play a game, because why would I have any incentive to save a world or become powerful in a world that is totally dead and artificial.

A huge misunderstanding about Bethesda is that they make Immersive Sim games, not RPGs. Other Immersive Sims are Deus Ex, Thief, System Shock, and the first 3D Ultima game. Bethesda's world building and the level of simulation is unprecedented and is the reason that no other developer can copycat them, because they have been building their engine for 20+ years.

I'm not even saying that Bethesda is the ideal developer for Fallout, over Obsidian, but unfortunately, a lot of bad decisions were made in the past, bad games were made, and Fallout was sold, and all I'm saying is that Bethesda is a great developer. I can respect that old school fans of Fallout might not like Bethesda developing it, but just don't attack them for being "greedy", when in reality, I think they have shown more care in the way they craft and support their games than most developers.

 

[Zentropy]

And I'll say this, as someone who adores Oblivion and has spent more time playing it than probably every other game combined, all the work that went into the AI and schedule etc, was a complete waste. It really doesn't add that much to the experience and in many ways detracts from it. They were far too ambitious with the ai and npcs and the game is worse for it. The world is mediocre, buggy and uncanny. They've slowly dialed it back because they realized no one cares if Herminnia Cinna goes on vacation once a month. That's development time they couldve spent adding actual content to the game.

The most important character in Bethesda games is the WORLD itself. Having a living world with AI that will go on with their lives instead of just waiting for the player character to come along and interact with them is, imo, the greatest achievement in modern game development, and I think that the more they develop this aspect of their games, the better.

Think of it this way: it's a totally unique, highly advanced, bleeding edge feature in video games, with no other developer willing or able to copy it. If Bethesda stopped building these complex, living breathing worlds, then nobody else would either, and that would be a shame for all of video games.