Infinite leveling or locked leveling?

Discussion in 'Future Fallout Game Discussion' started by NotAcasul, May 29, 2016.

Infinite or locked?

  1. Infinite

    6 vote(s)
  2. Lock

    44 vote(s)
  1. NotAcasul

    NotAcasul meanie

    Mar 17, 2016
    What do you think is good for the next Fallout game?

    On the one hand, infinite leveling makes things fun and rewarding.

    On the other hand, it leads to over-powered characters.

    I wanted to get all of your opinions.
  2. Sergeant Politeness

    Sergeant Politeness Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?

    Jun 20, 2015
    This is Bethesda we're talking about, every character will get overpowered pretty quickly. Since Fallout 5 will be a power fantasy, it might as well let you become a God on Earth.

    Even if they do put a lock, it would probably let you raise most skills to 100 anyway.
    Last edited: May 29, 2016
  3. NotAcasul

    NotAcasul meanie

    Mar 17, 2016
    What if I made it, instead? What about you?

    I'm not talking about how much of a pessimist you are, I'm asking you what the best possible solution is.
    • [Like] [Like] x 1
  4. Spacemunkey

    Spacemunkey Vault Senior Citizen

    Dec 4, 2015
    There is nothing rewarding being able to get all the perks/special points. Over coming adversity is rewarding and a level cap does that. All god leveling does is make you spend points into shit you don't want or need for your character, and at the end of the day all of a sudden that pacifistic scientist with low charisma is an expert gunslinger who can talk their way out of anything, and that high charisma low int gunslinger can now build fucking robots. Infinite leveling also allows you to not have to worry about your build because you'll get it all eventually, and for me those special points are a big part of who my character is, where they've been, and what kind of choices they make.
    • [Like] [Like] x 8
  5. Black Angel

    Black Angel Grand Inquisitor of the Ordo Hereticus

    Mar 21, 2016
    With that mindset, there are the likes of those who keep on parroting how Fallout now 'belong' to Bethesda. Seriously, not being pessimistic, but rather realistic.

    What's the point of infinite leveling, anyway? Fun? Okay, maybe in MMOs and/or ARPGs. I never heard of other RPGs with infinite leveling anyway, except maybe the Soulsborne series but that's another talk. Rewarding? Pfft, my ass. What's so rewarding with infinite leveling, especially when enemies scales with you, and the awesome loot also scaled, effectively locked you out of the oh-so awesome exploration aspect. The older Fallout(s) (dunno about New Vegas) doesn't have loot that scale with levels, hence its' actually rewarding if you're stubborn enough to go through high level area and using the character's skills you traverse the dangerous maps and stumble upon stuff you weren't supposed to get until you were higher level. Oh well, once again the previous games have already done everything properly.

    Like Sergeant said, we're talking about Bethesda here. They were too obvious in wanting to make MMOs in the future.
    • [Like] [Like] x 5
  6. Sergeant Politeness

    Sergeant Politeness Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?

    Jun 20, 2015
    If we assume that Bethesda design philosophy's suddenly changes and they decide to make games where your build is acknowledged and matter, not letting the player become good at everything is obviously the best choice and a level cap is a way to achieve this.

    But considering that this is Bethesda we're talking about... Fallout 5 will be an action game about killing things without any challenge and becoming stronger. When there is no possibility to have a real build to begin with, infinite levelling is not really a big problem. It only reflects the biggest issues.
    • [Like] [Like] x 1
  7. 0wing

    0wing Все умрут, а я волномут

    Mar 23, 2015
    Infinite leveling devalues your character's development since you can eventually maximize most stats and just feels unrealistic TBH.
    • [Like] [Like] x 2
  8. Sergeant Politeness

    Sergeant Politeness Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?

    Jun 20, 2015
    Is there even anyone who got to the "max" level of Fallout 4? I do not know how quickly you level up but that must require wasting so much hours grind...erh, I mean doing radiant quests that only a few players will get there.

    So, there is some sort of character development, but most perks seems so boring that it doesn't increase role-playing as far as I know. In the end, the game is shit with a level cap or not.
  9. Millim

    Millim Half-way Through My Half-life

    Oct 13, 2010
    It adds this little thing called "Replayability" (I don't know if Bethesda is aware of the term, it's not really commonly used).
    But all sarcasm aside, locking your levelling up adds more challenge to the game, and that's what makes a fun game, Challenge.
    I actively get pissed off over how unbalanced F3 and especially F4 are in comparison to F1,2 and NV.

    Also, taking away a locked levelling system just defuses the point of your RPG. The whole idea behind an RPG is that you get to effectively create your own character. It's a unique experience which is why I enjoy the Genre so much.
    Locking that just says "Oh, anyone can be anything whenever they want"
    There is no reward, you just become a God of everything.

    Which is annoying, the Sole Survivor is my least favourite Fallout protagonist, mostly because Bethesda feels to the need to make him good at everything.

    The reason why locking your levelling system has been going on for decades is because it works extremely well.
    It's realistic in terms of, no one can be good at everything.

    But then again, Bethesda don't get what makes Fallout work or "SPECIAL" if I wanted to be cheesy.
    They don't even get the point of the SPECIAL system which is laughable.

    But yeah, infinity levelling bad. Locked levelling good.
    • [Like] [Like] x 1
  10. Kadscaner

    Kadscaner NMA’s only mutie

    Feb 4, 2016
    Locked for sure, it keeps the game challenging until the end. If you have infinite leveling you will get characters with 100000 health that cannot be killed, which essentially breaks the game.
  11. GlutinousRice

    GlutinousRice Ne travaillez jamais

    Nov 7, 2015
    Locked. What the point of character build when you are a god with infinite +1 level?
  12. NotAcasul

    NotAcasul meanie

    Mar 17, 2016
    Where do we lock it?

    Level 25, 50, what do you think?
  13. IndignantHedgehog

    IndignantHedgehog It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Jan 7, 2016
    Depends on the game.
  14. NotAcasul

    NotAcasul meanie

    Mar 17, 2016
    How about Fallout 5? or V? Whatever.
  15. Black Angel

    Black Angel Grand Inquisitor of the Ordo Hereticus

    Mar 21, 2016
    What he meant is if it's like Fallout 1/2/NV or 3/4, or for more detailed explanation is how the game balance the combat and other mechanics like skill checks etc etc. To be fair, even in New Vegas it was so easy to get every skills to 100, which is why I get Jsawyer mod to put the level cap to 35, but it still fairly easy to get most of the skills to 100. If it's like 1/2, well 1/2 allow us to increase our skills past 100% so there's that. 3 got Bobbleheads and stupid ass Almost Perfect perk, while 4.... can't speak for 4, but from what I've heard it's atrocious.

    And then there's also the thing with either the enemies got level scaling or not, and everything else that need to be taken into account to balance before finally decided on whether or not we lock the level on 25, 50, or even 99.
  16. IndignantHedgehog

    IndignantHedgehog It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Jan 7, 2016
    I actually like a limited level of scaling. Where they can have a certain range that enimies can be in and they go up with you a bit. So on higher levels raiders are more likely to have a 9mm sub-machinegun vs a 9mm pistol, stuff like.
    • [Like] [Like] x 2
  17. 0wing

    0wing Все умрут, а я волномут

    Mar 23, 2015
    V has come to? (although it's came to F4 tbh. MGSV players might get it)
    • [Like] [Like] x 2
  18. Atlas

    Atlas Wasteland Wanderer

    Jan 13, 2016
    As most of the other posters have said, Locked leveling adds a bit of challenge and meaning to the game that you just won't get with infinite. Especially when, as with Oblivion and Fallout 4, the enemies constantly level alongside you. It gives a feeling of pointlessness to the whole thing--why should I spend all this time trying to level up my character, when the difficulty will never change?

    That raider you fought at level one is still going to be just as challenging to you at level three hundred and forty two as he was when you started. That isn't fun, that's lazy--and I would even go so far as to say its even worse than not having levels at all. At least in that scenario, your character can gain power through armor and weapons, and as anyone who's played an MMO knows when you finally find that legendary weapon you feel like you accomplished something.

    Personally, I don't have an issue with maxing out your stats in level locked games. Even in Fallout NV, it was difficult to actually reach 100 in everything unless that was your goal from the beginning, in which case we can say that your Courier actively sought to master everything. You HAVE to work for it, to sacrifice perks and hunt down the skill books and get enough money for the implants. Unlike in infinite leveling where it will just happen eventually.

    This is all a moot argument, though. Deep down we all know the next Fallout game is going to remove Special stats, make all perks available from level one, and start you off in a full suit of Power Armor with a story line revolving around finding your wife/dog or something.
    • [Like] [Like] x 1
  19. SpecialHands

    SpecialHands First time out of the vault

    Jun 16, 2016
    Level lock every single time. The worst aspect of Fallout 4 for me is my character isn't my character. I didn't get to decide if he was smart, charismatic but weak, or strong and thick as pigshit. I didn't get to decide if he was an Imperialist or whether he was more into scavenging because there were no limits forcing me to make those choices. On NV I sometimes spend 15 minutes on the level up screen tweaking and thinking. On 4 i just slap any old thing because I know I'll be able to get everything anyway and so little of it impacts the game on a whole.
  20. Draitex

    Draitex Northern Beast from the Swedish tundra

    Aug 5, 2016
    Locked, It adds more variety to builds and playthroughs