Armor should get damaged with use

Discussion in 'Fallout General Modding' started by oxidize, May 26, 2012.

  1. oxidize

    oxidize It Wandered In From the Wastes

    165
    Apr 18, 2012
    I hope someone makes a mod that will make armor on the player get damaged. For example the more you are hit, the more damaged it gets. And it can become useless if it gets too damaged. It shouldn't get damaged just from time, but only from getting hit.
    You should be able to repair it yourself or take it to a repair shop in town.
    How do you think this would affect the game? I think it would be big challenge and add replayability and fun to the game.
     
  2. smilodom

    smilodom Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    344
    Apr 17, 2008
    You are absolutely right, this is not the first time someone talked about this issue.
    I don't know why we have already a 51b manual in the game..
     
  3. Surf Solar

    Surf Solar So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Aug 20, 2009
    I can see this working well in the game, the FOnline engine has it already and I never felt it is too arbitrary in the game.
     
  4. SealyStar

    SealyStar It Wandered In From the Wastes

    109
    Mar 23, 2012
    I like this idea. However, from a technical standpoint, I'm not even sure if it's possible. I would think that if it WAS possible, armor durability would have to be stored like ammunition in guns.
     
  5. smilodom

    smilodom Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    344
    Apr 17, 2008
    The same case with the food and radiation system...sigh...
     
  6. oxidize

    oxidize It Wandered In From the Wastes

    165
    Apr 18, 2012
    I don't think that it should be possible to loot armor of dead bodies though, cause armor would be damaged beyond repair and it would make game too easy...
    I don't think it should be too complicated, the more damage you take the more damged the armor gets...
     
  7. .Pixote.

    .Pixote. Carbon Dated and Proud
    Modder

    Sep 14, 2009
    I've already made the art for it, with the idea that you can loot armor from the dead. Everything is built, so it might make an appearance in Mutants Rising. I just don't know how they will attach damage points to the actual armor itself. Maybe the damage resistance should drop with each hit.

     
  8. Cubik2k

    Cubik2k Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?
    Modder

    470
    Nov 22, 2005
    Few years ago I tried to make armor damage system, it is possible to make it. If it is interesting in this I try to restart work on that project :)
     
  9. Lexx

    Lexx Background Radiant
    Moderator Modder

    Apr 24, 2005
    The only way I can imagine right now is adding scripts to the armors. But wouldn't this cause the "too many scripts on items" bug again?

    I personally only wouldn't mind to loot broken armors from dead enemies, if it is nearly worthless. In any other case (armor still being quite usefull), it could break the game balance very fast.
     
  10. Surf Solar

    Surf Solar So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Aug 20, 2009
    Fallout 1 allowed to loot armors from bodies and it wasn't that much of a gamebreaking thing, IMO.
     
  11. Lexx

    Lexx Background Radiant
    Moderator Modder

    Apr 24, 2005
    I cannot remember looting armors from the dead in Fallout 1.
     
  12. Izual

    Izual Pipe rifle & chopsticks

    378
    Sep 18, 2009
    You can actually loot armors from the dead in Fallout 1. Check the Order's Fallout Iron Man topic, a few of us had to burn Junktown to the ground and turned into armor merchants :D
     
  13. Surf Solar

    Surf Solar So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Aug 20, 2009
  14. oxidize

    oxidize It Wandered In From the Wastes

    165
    Apr 18, 2012
    I would put that everyone who dies loses their armor due to it being damaged beyond repair... I mean, you can't repair everything.... it's stupid.
     
  15. agris

    agris Still Mildly Glowing

    245
    Jul 8, 2004
    Bear with me, seeing this topic inspired me. I don't know Fallout's scripting language but I had a few ideas that I wanted to share in the hopes it might help anyone who DOES have the scripting knowledge to put a system in place.

    Does each instance of an in-game armor have a unique identifier? If so, I have an idea to avoid the 'too many items bug' that would occur if a script were attached to each armor.

    Assuming there exists a way to reference an individual piece of armor in the game (i.e. not the item 'type' but it's specific instance), one global script could run that monitors all the 'on hit' instances that occur to the player while wearing an armor identified by that unique ID. This script would populate a large matrix of unique item codes and the number of hits / HP of damage the player sustained while wearing it. Periodically, the script would check to see if the item has accumulated enough hits to change quality level, and the item would be swapped for a Used, Heavily Used or Broken variant. Overall, it would be organized something like this:

    1. For the Player
    Each armor 'type' could have 4 tiers of status:
    • 1. Pristine: 0 to X hits
      2. Used: X to Y hits
      3. Heavily Used: Y to Z hits
      4. Broken: > Z hits
    Hits could either represent the actual number of hits the player has taken (tracked by said global script) while wearing the individual armor, or by the HP damage received by the player while wearing the armor. The latter is ideal IMO, but would require distinguishing between non-weapon damage (i.e. radiation, poison, etc) and weapon-induced damage. Each armor archetype could be assigned a hits/HP threshold, concomitant with the quality of the armor (P.A. takes more hits than leather, etc).

    This would by far be the most complicated part to introduce, but if it could be done the rest would be trivial. It could be more complicated based on the damage type, but I think that gets into the realm of too realistic and doesn't add enough to counter balance the complexity required.


    2. For NPCs
    To reduce complexity, each NPC is equipped with pristine-state armor. Upon death, if the NPC is supposed to drop their armor, then the global script would kick in and do a random chance to determine the status of the armor. Something like:
    • 10% Pristine
      30% Used (X hits, i.e. barely used)
      40% Heavily Used (Y hits, i.e. barely heavily used)
      20% Broken
    This would simplify the overhead required by the global script AND make it easier to track. Rather than tracking the number of hits every NPC received and dropping armor of some intermediate number of hits, armor of a general condition (i.e. used Leather with X hits, not a value between X and Y) is dropped which reduces the complexity.


    3. For Shopkeepers
    The simplest, I would assert that shopkeepers only sell Pristine (0 hits) armor, same as vanilla.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    As to repairing, I don't think directly giving the PC the ability to repair armor would be good. It would minimize the effect of degrading equipment, which is counter to the point. I feel as if several NPCs should exist in the world that are capable of repairing each class of armor:
    • Leather/cloth types: Someone in Klamath, Tanner in Modoc, NCR Ranger station in NCR, Vic's daughter in VC.
      Metal/tesla types: New Reno Arms shopkeeper, NCR Rangers, Vic's daughter, Skeeter in GECKO, Ratch in NCR, San Fran, Navarro quartermaster.
      Combat Armor types: Vic's daughter, NCR rangers, San Fran, Enclave, 'secret' NPC in New Reno?
      P.A types: Navarro quartermaster. Perhaps this is the exception to what the player can fix, due to limited supply. And existence of those manuals. Could be a quest.
    These locations are semi-balanced in that both good and evil chars can access at least 1 NPC of a given armor repair type. Perhaps Vic could repair the Leather / Metal variants too, to give him a bit more usefulness.

    A system like this would remove some of the over the top money generated by selling armor in the game. I also think the number of hits each armor can take should be slanted towards 'too many' rather than 'too few'. Whew, ok I'm done.
     
  16. .Pixote.

    .Pixote. Carbon Dated and Proud
    Modder

    Sep 14, 2009
    Nice ideas there Agris - I thought that the actual animation deaths should be the key indicator. This is what I proposed to Killap way back.







     
  17. Surf Solar

    Surf Solar So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Aug 20, 2009
    I am a bit against the idea to strip the power armor off of a dead body - it was said in FO1 that this is nigh impossible.

    I really like your art for damaged armors and the ideas in that document though, Pixote! :ok:
     
  18. .Pixote.

    .Pixote. Carbon Dated and Proud
    Modder

    Sep 14, 2009
    I think ripping power armor would need super science and repair skills (150+), basically it's impractical.
     
  19. NovaRain

    NovaRain Casual Modder Modder

    Mar 10, 2007
    Does that mean choosing Bloody Mess will almost make players unable to loot any armors? (unless reducing the violence level)
     
  20. .Pixote.

    .Pixote. Carbon Dated and Proud
    Modder

    Sep 14, 2009
    This is just a concept, it might never see the day, and also Bloody Mess was a comedy trait, only crazy people choose it. :P