[Black Steel] alternate skills

Discussion in 'Fallout General Modding' started by Lich, May 30, 2005.

  1. Lich

    Lich Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    829
    Dec 23, 2004
    Got interesting ideas for new traits:

    Hacker (computer thief)
    +science (and possibility to break into computers without password, let say some item like electonic card: ultimate key to terminals)
    +lockpick (and electronic lockpick item on start)

    But that need made something new: traits give specify items on start game ..items that you cant find other way in game!

    Survivalist (traper, green beret)
    +first aid (and "traper book" possibility to take food from animals and plants that give something like stimpacks (+ to health)
    +traps (and some special traps- items, hunting skill that may be usefull to tactical fight with any enemies)

    Prophet (man who predict future)
    +luck (and item: something like "eight ball" from New Reno that will shown/say about every secrets hidden on location you are)

    this will be powerfull item so only this you can gain on this trait(possible to find treasures: lot money and rare items)

    Sniper
    +35% to all guns (small, energy, heavy)
    +item: night vision (enemies in night will shoot less accurete and you more, that give you advantage)

    I think to made this way all traits, olways you gain extremly rare items and large plus to skills statistisc (+50%)

    Other way to made it its gain 3-5 perks from begining game, similar to trait so for example survivalist will gain gecko skinning, scouting

    The second idea is maybe more easy to made.
     
  2. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Apr 3, 2003
    Uhm...the idea of a trait is that you gain something, but have to turn in something else. Bruiser makes you strong and slow, finesse makes you fast but weak.

    You can't make traits that're just bonuses, that's what perks are for
     
  3. Rev. Layle

    Rev. Layle A Smooth-Skin

    667
    Jul 26, 2005
    Or the trait is just something "cool" tht doesn;t not affect gameplay (like "Bloody Mess" - no ral advantages or disads except to see the worst death possible)
     
  4. Lich

    Lich Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    829
    Dec 23, 2004
    Already traits are mostly useless so chosing gifted is standard.
    I want make more bonuses that make desire to play fev times the same game that will looking different when you chose it.
    There are two traits to chose that give some extra combinations of gameplay.

    To make this, these bonuses must give something rare that cant be found other way in game. Some quest and locations will be unaviable to other persons- that make legend when someone (you) find something in game and other not.

    So everyone seem play the same game but trully not the same!
    (and thats amazing)
     
  5. Rev. Layle

    Rev. Layle A Smooth-Skin

    667
    Jul 26, 2005
    well some traits maybe considered useless... but all but one (IIRC) actually affect gameplay somewhat ("Bloody Mess" does not alter the game mechanics of certain situations for your character, however it does affect display mechanics when some dies by your character's hand) and the ones that affect gameplay mechanics have a positive and negative side to them.

    as Kharn said, just giving you bonuses is 1) a cheap way (IMO) to make you stronger when you start out and 2) more of a perk (perk are just that, they are strictly advantages, so perks always benefit you in some way). People may argue, "well Gifted makes you stronger!". True it does, but the original intention was to attempt to balance that out by giving you lower skills and skill points per level while having gifted, turns out the advantage is better than the disadvantage (this all comes down to a QA, testing, game balance issue that wasn't 100% thought out - plus Gifted is not AS strong in FO1, per-se, as you wont raise as many levels, and the side opportunities to raise skills aside from leveling-up are more reduced )

    anyways the "traits" you described a few posts ago, would be very nice perks indeed. And Sniper, well, there is already a sniper Perk. Making it a trait makes no sense. Traits are kind of innate abilities or characteristics you grew up with, no so much learned skill advantages.
     
  6. Lich

    Lich Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    829
    Dec 23, 2004
    So we have stats, skills, traits, perks.
    But this not all (!) because some items can increase these things

    -drugs can increase some stats
    -books can increase some skills

    New idea is leave whole system, anyway hardcoded and extend items influence to gameplay and invent something new

    -from books you can learn all skills
    -drugs affect all stats
    -some new groups that change your traits and perks

    How made it?

    Guild buildings -there you can learn some extra perks (example: gecko skining for outdoorsmans)
    Random encounters- extension, not only curious locations, there you can gain some extra/strange traits that change your person

    Already i known how made new drugs, maybe change his names to quick implants that change all stats even can make you more age
     
  7. Rev. Layle

    Rev. Layle A Smooth-Skin

    667
    Jul 26, 2005
    remember (when making new drugs) that drugs should affect stats in two ways:
    1) increase some stats with other stats dropping at the smae time (like psycho).... after a period of time, they return to normal
    2) increase some stats, after a period of time, the stats that were increased will drop below the character normal for another period of time (like mentats, IIRC)

    Note: all drugs should have some addiction chance. when addicted certain stats suffer continuously unless 1) the addiction time period passes and the character is no longer addicted OR 2) you find more of the drug to feed the addiction

    and of course items can increase things, like you said... the cool shades can increase your CH (as long as you keep it in your inventory). The cookie will give you 1 extra AP for several hours

    As for books, don't go the route of FO2, books everywhere, one could increase thier small arms, first aid, science, repair, and outdoorsman skills to 80+ % without spending a single skill point. Having some for every skill would be interesting, just keep the amount of books to minimum, you want players to go "WOW I found a cool book to help improve a skill" instead of "um, wow, uh, this is the 30th book i have found in the two days i played...."
     
  8. Lich

    Lich Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    829
    Dec 23, 2004
    Yes i know how make increase and then decrease stats after a period of time.

    Interesting thing is about the cool shades item.
    How will game look like when you use that similar script to every items?
    -When you walk into NPC house with big bazooka or minigun in hands, they sure will fear you. So holding big weapons may decrease some stats like charisma because you seem bad.
    -When you wear power armour or just holding it this may decrease agility
    -Some things may smell like gecko skin, so decrease your perception when holding it


    That will make pay attention what you got, the same work in real world. I remember F1 game, enter Junktown- guard stop you when see guns in you hands.
     
  9. Rev. Layle

    Rev. Layle A Smooth-Skin

    667
    Jul 26, 2005
    Well, there are general scripts that handle how certain people react to you while armed with a weapon. Could be interesting to have different reactions depending on the type of weapon you carry.
     
  10. Laven

    Laven First time out of the vault

    30
    Dec 10, 2004
    I see no problem with those traits Lich mentioned earlier. I think it would be cool and that a good balance would be a difficult game demanding that you use your specialities.

    Maybe there should then be an option to be an "Average Joe"
    What a challenge!
     
  11. Lich

    Lich Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    829
    Dec 23, 2004
    These specialisation seem make only bonuses but you cant see all game parts and this is the limitation. You cant enter some locations, find some items or get it other way.

    16 traits and 18 skills, almost every trait may give extra bonus to some skill (your specialisation)
     
  12. Demonslayer

    Demonslayer Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    968
    Aug 8, 2005
    Traits are meant to be good in one thing and bad in other...that's why those to are kinda useless
     
  13. Laven

    Laven First time out of the vault

    30
    Dec 10, 2004
    I think that the "chem" traits were for those of us that wanted to play the game like an Rpg and not some perception of ten/sniper bore-fest
     
  14. Lich

    Lich Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    829
    Dec 23, 2004
    Specialisation skill system
    That will make three ways to get trough game and alternate endings.

     
  15. Rev. Layle

    Rev. Layle A Smooth-Skin

    667
    Jul 26, 2005
    so throwing weapons (like grenades and stuff) are pretty much out? not that I used them much, maybe other players did?
     
  16. BT-Virus

    BT-Virus First time out of the vault

    2
    Aug 20, 2005
    I used to use grenades quite often, well.. Sometimes. Mainly when I have to reload the gun and I have few action points left though.

    Say if I have to reload my shotgun it takes 2 points, to fire it takes 5. I have 6 points. Throwing a grenade will take 4, I would use a grenade then.
     
  17. Lich

    Lich Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    829
    Dec 23, 2004
    Throwing IS melee flame. You can throw but only molotovs and grenades make fire domage. I made it because critters will have three types of protection: standard, fire and electric, or better- three types of weakness. So you can kill them only using specify weapons in range (guns) and close (melee) distance. Also get this items, equipment only when disarm some kind of traps. To get flame weapons you must learn how disarm flame.

    You got 3 skills to specialise, now all them you can use in weapons type of specialisation. Other things usefull like first-aid and outdoorsman you can learn from books.

    Unarmed is standard close range weapon
    Melee weapons in now electric close range weapons

    In Flame weapons is something different because guns are close and melee are range, but it fit to system range-close weapons.

    Other skills:
    Lockpick is standard traps
    Repair is electric traps (like forcefield that need repair it to get trough)
    Traps are flame traps
     
  18. Amun

    Amun First time out of the vault

    13
    Jul 23, 2005
    What about optional traits? Will there be any new ones?
     
  19. Hes Vital

    Hes Vital First time out of the vault

    28
    Aug 28, 2005
    I prefer the Small, Big, Energy than this new one.

    Try something like:
    Standard Guns
    Explosive Guns
    Flame Guns
    Electric Guns
    Trowing
    Hand to Hand(Unarmed + melee).
     
  20. Lich

    Lich Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    829
    Dec 23, 2004
    It is possible to add new Karma and they can work as alternate traits and perks, so i made guilds where you can buy new skills.This will work like in Might & Magic game where you first buy membership and then magic spells. But here this will be something like shops with skills. Like this on picture: "membership of healers guild". This will let you to buy many heal skills.



    Already its project but i think its possible to made items that can be used only when you got some GVAR activate (and this will be connected to this new skills) So in practice you can heal poison and radiation using first aid box when you got "cure poison skill" and "cure radiation skill"