Fat Shaming: What's NMA's Thoughts?

Discussion in 'General Discussion Forum' started by TransgenderVaultDeweller, Jan 18, 2016.

  1. TransgenderVaultDeweller

    TransgenderVaultDeweller "Fallout 4 adds to the lore"

    426
    Aug 14, 2015
    We have a feminist thread going that some how got into talking about Islam.

    Might as well have another discussion on obesity. It's similar like my last thread if obesity is as big as it's discussed on the media. But i want to know aspects of people who trying to defend their obesity by trying to rationalize excuses or otherwise indifferent to the situation they are in and correlate any criticism as them being shamed or personally attacked viciously. This doesn't go to say people trying to be dicks and just insult people due to their appearance. No, What i'm eluding to is if a parent says to his offspring that he is taking her to a nutritionist to and psychologist to deal with problems and then her/him throwing a fit.

    Or the people who honestly believe health at every sizes. So on and so forth. Big difference.

    Discuss, But don't derail the thread.
     
  2. Korin

    Korin So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
    Admin

    Aug 6, 2010
    I think there's a difference between "fat shaming" as it's put and saying being overweight is unhealthy. Smoking cigarettes is unhealthy for instance but you're less likely to hear someone use that trait as an insult. Nobody should be debating whether being overweight is unhealthy. "Lose weight" is probably the most frequently given advice by a common doctor. But they aren't like, "Lose weight you fat disgusting pig".
     
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  3. Kilus

    Kilus Not Australian Orderite

    May 3, 2003
    Fat shaming is about cruelty not helping people. Healthy at every size is just denialism. This isn't a middle position rather than a rejection that either 'side' is an actual valid side.
     
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  4. Illuminati Confirmed!

    Illuminati Confirmed! Banned

    553
    Dec 15, 2015
    If you don't like how certain societies are treating you, no one is forcing you to be a part of them or even interact with them.

    Fat people are shamed for a reason, just like alcoholics, drug addicts, promiscuous people, and so on.

    That being said, I haven't actually witnessed any fat shaming since elementary school. So if fat people are trying to paint themselves as some endangered group now, I call bullshit.
     
  5. DVL

    DVL Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    309
    Nov 19, 2015
    I think "fatshaming" is a poor choice of word from what you've described in the content of your post. Fatshaming implies bullying. What you described is criticism and how criticism isn't received well or at all.
    If I offhandedly tell a friend he should stop smoking it's not like I expect him to. It's a habit he's picked up for a reason.
    Assuming that they acknowledge they have a problem at all, it's not like insulting them will help the process along.
     
  6. Hassknecht

    Hassknecht For hate's sake. Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Aug 16, 2010
    That whole "health at every size" stuff leads to many entertaining moments on the Internet, though.
    There was this "fathlete" (yeah, they think that's a thing) who once "ran" a marathon (in 13 hours. Yeah, it's not an "athletic feat" if it's something everyone can do) and who thought she could do an Iron Man run in 17 hours. It was pretty much doomed from the start, and she didn't even finish the swimming portion fast enough to not get kicked out. Swimming technique? Self-described as a modified dog-paddling. Seriously. But she posted A LOT of selfies on her blog during her training.
    The overall description of the event was pretty hilarious, too. Apparently there were some similarly delusional women attending the event, with at least one bursting into tears because the water temperature made a wetsuit optional, and another having never swum the full distance at all .
    This is what you get for telling people that everyone can do everything, always.
    Delusion.
     
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  7. TransgenderVaultDeweller

    TransgenderVaultDeweller "Fallout 4 adds to the lore"

    426
    Aug 14, 2015

    What i was referring to in OP is how Criticism is often conflated as bullying and lumped together unfairly.
     
  8. DVL

    DVL Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    309
    Nov 19, 2015
    That wasn't entirely clear given the titling versus whatever your thesis was supposed to be.
    Besides that. I agree? They're different? And denying that you have a problem is a bad thing.
     
  9. Scipio the Elder

    Scipio the Elder Whiskey Blues

    66
    Jan 9, 2016
    I see your point. Sadly it comes down to, what seems like the entirety of the West, a lack of better understanding behind criticism and blatant insults. (Both of which are funny; why people care what others think I don't know.) Guess people are simply oversensitive for no reason in-particular.

    Though yes. Its good for people to chip in and say things like "You should consider a diet; think of your future health." or "You're a god damn walking chimney!" to remind said person their future ain't so bright. Some people just consider that is be a little bash when it is more of a reality check. Hell I still get told I'm a walking chimney and take it as a badge of honor. Not living past 40 club. :bow:

    A good question would be where the hell this increased insecurity is coming from. In the past you'd be told to toughen up by most folks if you took everything to heart. Seems to be letting off now a days?
     
  10. DVL

    DVL Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    309
    Nov 19, 2015
    If you were to say that's the entire human condition, then I'd agree. What, people are defensive about their ego? What hogwash.
    Why back in my day, we walked uphills in the snow both ways to school. And people knew to take insults as tough love.


    I've seen the opposite, where a fat guy on Youtube said he knew he had a problem but he didn't want the fatshaming, because it wasn't actually constructive. He was already taking steps to rectify it, but it's a slow and gradual lifestyle change. And a large part that didn't happen before because he was too apathetic and depressed during that phase of his life.
     
  11. TransgenderVaultDeweller

    TransgenderVaultDeweller "Fallout 4 adds to the lore"

    426
    Aug 14, 2015
    Telling people to toughen up is pretty stupid as well. It's not even advice and lacks empathy. Nothing actually gets solved when you just wave your hand and be brick wall about it.

    It's why i also believe the same about zero tolerance , Zero tolerance is zero intelligence, Telling someone to tough it up is the exact opposite of productivity.
     
  12. Cimmerian Nights

    Cimmerian Nights So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Aug 20, 2004
    You're all so blinded by your thin privilege you have no idea the microtransgressions that people of size are subjected to. Society's prevailing calorie-centric notions of health are both sizeist, and impose an unrealistic and unattainable standard of beauty.
     
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  13. ZigzagPX4

    ZigzagPX4 The Swiftness of the Ranger

    Nov 22, 2015
    I'm mostly uneducated on the aspects of social progression and stuff like this fat shaming I see quite rarely.

    But here's how I see it, because let it never be said I never tried to share my opinion on a subject I'm not good at!

    Fat shaming is a form of harassment and refers to a the use of insults and taunts to criticise and bully an individual based on their obesity affecting their appearance.

    Promoting weight loss is the act of communicating to an individual how attempting to reduce their obesity can be beneficial to their physical health and their appearance, but mostly their health. It is usually (and only should be) directed at those who are overweight to the point that it negatively affects their lifestyle and their health.

    Fat shaming and promoting weight loss are two very different things that wrongly get lumped together. Fat shaming is undoubtedly wrong. Promoting weight loss should be done under the right context.

    Done.

    Ha. Ha. Really? :roll:

    I think this form of mockery is the dead horse of social media.
     
  14. Scipio the Elder

    Scipio the Elder Whiskey Blues

    66
    Jan 9, 2016
    Yet which would you rather there be? People who simply don't care or people trying to micromanage other people's feelings & words? Both are idiotic and rely on people having an intelligence above 5 yet only one builds a character to take most things as a grain of salt.

    We're seeing what the micromanaging of words & feelings is currently making; for better or worse.

    You can have my shekels. Made me laugh far too much. :drunk:
     
  15. DVL

    DVL Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    309
    Nov 19, 2015
    You're presenting a false dichotomy. It's not an either-or. And in the case of a complete stranger, "not caring" is exactly the correct thing to be. Mind your own business. They might know they have a problem and doing some varying amount of thing to correct it. They might not. You're not your brother's keeper.

    Seriously read what you wrote about micromanaging feelings and words. Look right at it. Because it sounds like something Big Brother might write.

    If you have legitimate grounds for caring about the other person, or are at least pretending, then don't dishonestly pretend your sadism is altruism. It also works both ways. You can't expect people take criticism if you can't actually give legitimate criticism.

    While it's melodramatic, I know what an abusive relationship looks like. In my case, I was fortunate that it was over minor bullshit instead of actual problems like my weight or sexual identity. But looking back, I'd have picked being completely alone to having friends if I had it do over again. I don't care about the justifications they made to themselves, I lost more than I got out of it. Whatever minor or petty cure they thought they were offering just made made me more sullen and angry when they stuck the knife in and started twisting.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2016
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  16. PossibleCabbage

    PossibleCabbage Vault 22 Survivor

    889
    Jul 2, 2015
    Really, I think commenting on the health, gender, sex, sexual orientation, race, etc. of complete strangers is distasteful and improper period, end of sentence. Like if it's none of your business, don't make it your business.

    If you actually know a person then you can talk to them about this stuff without being a jerk, but you have to actually put the effort into "not being a jerk."

    The worst thing about "fat-shaming" as I see it is the notion that "making fun of people to make yourself feel superior to them" is passed off as somehow altruistic. Like you don't have to think that fat people are healthy, attractive, etc. but don't pass off "I am mocking you to make myself feel better" as anything but selfish. That sort of duplicity in people really bothers me.

    In general I have much more fondness and sympathy for "people who have a characteristic" than "people who mock or hate people who have that characteristic."
     
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  17. Scipio the Elder

    Scipio the Elder Whiskey Blues

    66
    Jan 9, 2016
    Of course not doing anything is the best option. That usually is; yet it does not allow for anything to occur at all. Its more fun to interfere with people's lives in the long run simply to interfere with them. Why not stir up drama when you can make a wreck out of nothing?
     
  18. .Pixote.

    .Pixote. Carbon Dated and Proud
    Modder

    Sep 14, 2009
    Who's Fat?...
     
  19. The Vault Dweller

    The Vault Dweller always looking for water.

    Aug 24, 2004
    I see lots of people in public who have visible trouble just walking and the only thing I see wrong with them is them being very obese. Granted some of them have health problems that make it difficult to get around separate from being overweight, but I'm sure many of those were caused by the obesity. Unfortunately I've noticed that fat people are easily offended by any comment about their weight no matter how kindly worded or intended.
     
  20. Millim

    Millim Half-way Through My Half-life
    Orderite

    Oct 13, 2010
    Okay, I believe anyone should be as fat as they want, if someone wants an early grave, so be it.
    Hell, I would join them.
    I got no problem with people saying "Having fat is okay and beautiful" however, as long as it doesn't affect other people's health.
    If someone who is unable to get out of their bed because they physically unable due to their weight, and they say they are beautiful, then they are just delusional.
    I've noticed, it's the fat people who don't want to be fat, some would love to be able to get rid of the weight.
    But due to things such as having no self control, addiction to certain foods or even depression has kind of stopped them from a young age.
    Ironically, it could be those people who are bullying someone for being fat, being the cause of a serious issue that is just pushing them to be even more obese.
    I think pushing for healthy lifestyles (if someone is going to be pushing it) is acceptable.

    Or we could just say everyone is ugly and there's nothing you can do about it, I say we go for this solution.