Hoping for the future by reminiscing about the past...

Chancellor Kremlin

Mildly Dipped
Hi, im new here.

But let me tell you where I stand. I am an old school/old guard fallout fan. Fallout 1 and 2, are quite possibly the best games ever made. Fallout 2 in my opinion is a priceless game. It represents the golden age of a bygone era, the pinnacle of achievement in the gaming world.

It excelled in being an rpg, and a hilariously serious one at that, like Half Life 2 excells in being a FPS.

Anyway, I haven't purchased or played Fallout 3 yet, but from what I hear it can be summed as follows: Its a good game, but a bad fallout sequel.

I hear annoying kids who cant be killed are a particular slap on the face of the true fallout community.

I miss the good old days where you could sledgehammer a kid in his groin if he pissed you off too much. Twisted mentality? PErhaps... but I will come to that in a minute.

Basically, for a future game, what should DEFINITELY be there is a good solid story line, a non-linear gaming experience (what made fallout one and two so replayable) and decent graphics.

But what about those extras that make the game what it is? Like in fallout 2, with its ambiguous morality. You could kill a kid, sure, but being labelled 'child killer', being hated by all and being chased by bounty hunters definitely put a large dent in your gameplay.

The lesson? If you want to be a bastard you are free to be one, but there will be consequences. One of the reasons I loved fallout is because it allowed you to be whatever you wanted. Most of the time I was generally a good guy, but an opportunistic one at that.

While I found playing good guys/girls the most rewarding, I found playing bad characters the most fun. The game had it all. You could be a gangster, you could be a pornstar, you could be a martial arts bruce lee master, you could join the brotherhood, you could even prostitute yourself if you wanted to! The possibilities were endless.

So what should a future game have of that sort of 'freedom'? Well, definitely all of the previous stuff, and definitely the dark humour and some of the cultural references that made the game so funny.

People these days are so worried about controversial themes in games that are likely to affect sales, such as drugs use, sex and nudity and even morality. Fallout had a way of asnwering to that with a simple mechanic: Kill kids, your game will almost become unplayable. Use drugs, you will become addicted and have a harder time playing your game. And sex was used to further your objectives. The mechanics are much as it is in the real world, you cannot do things that would screw you up in the real world without having similar consequences.

So perhaps a fallout 4 could integrate such 'adult themes' without too much problems. Or perhaps even expand on it. Allow your character to sleep with pretty much anybody, but have STD's play a part. Everybody remember the ubiquitous condoms in fallout 2? They could definitely play a part, as indeed they do in real life.

Or have the player face real and challenging situations, like a no win situation. I don't know, to save a village you have to let a small group of innocent villagers die, or something like that. Tests of character and so on. Situations that really immerse you into the story.

Or sidequests involving getting a job. ANything ranging from 'Expert Excrement Shover', dealing guns (a good possible way of getting factions against each other, weakening them or just arming yourself), being a gangster (well all loved the godfather undertones), a mechanic (allowing you to get parts for vehicles, mod them and so on), or even pimping/prostitution. YOu could rise the ranks and perhaps become the owner of the brothel.

Small side quests like that that don't directly add to the storyline, but help you in some way to further the game (through money, spare parts, influence, contacts (say the only way you can get to someone high in power is as a hooker - oh wait? Fallout 2 alredy did that with Myron. Wow those guys really DID think of everything!) etc etc etc... its quests and missions such as these that make the game replayable, you can take a break from playing the game and still play the game, but as a normal person and not as a vault-dweller trying to save the world. IT also makes the game replayable, not to mention, AWESOME!

SO yeah, I think thats about it. For a first post, I think its large as it is, so I will save other ideas for later. Ideally we should all pool our money, buy the fallout rights and make the game ourselves. OR perhaps we all play on the lotery and whoever wins does the same. Whichever is quicker.
Wow, first post, I spill my feelings onto this forum about the beauty that is Fallout 1 and 2, reminisc about the past, and not ONE person has ONE thing to say? :cry:

5 days and 74 views later and NOBODY feels inclined to either agree or disagree with me? What, has the excess radiation made you all lazy? Has Fallout 3 shocked you into such mental state of despair that catatonia has followed?

Jeez tough crowd.... :?
I would guess people don't feel there's much to say in your post.

However, bumping your own thread and/or double-posting is not allowed per our rules. Continue and I will lock the thread. If no one replies, no one replies, c'est la vie.
Well I'll bite....I'm actually now in the middle of a Fallout 1 game, will move on to F2 afterwards, and I agree with a lot of what you are saying.

Going further though, in a way I like the spartan feel of Fallout 1 at the moment, the fact that there are only a few quests at each location is a refreshing change from so many recent RPG's which spam the same fetch or kill quests from every character in a town.

The way the developers balanced it is perfect as it allows for the quests to mean more than just be mere XP generators. IF you want more experience well there are people to steal from, kill, locks to open etc. BUT THAT PART is up to YOU.

F2 seems to pack more and I used to like it more for that reason in the past, but now in light of all the overquested games released recently where you get so bogged down in side quests that you forget the point of why you are adventuring in the first place, I really like this approach.

The Witcher while having more side quests, also did not lose sight of the balance between packing stuff in just for the sake of it and giving the player just enough to do without having you lose focus on the main goal.
Is it ironic that so many fans apparently feel so much love for the old Fallout games yet a fanmade successor has not been made? I know its hard and complicated work but you think with all this worship more would have been completed in the 9-10 years since Fallout 2 was released. Sure there are plenty of "Work In Progress" projects, but just how long have these projects been in the works?

Oh well, Fallout Online, Shelter, Zero-Projekt and Fan Made Fallout look like their making some kind of progress.
Well, im not a real fan of RPG's.

FO2 was the first ever RPG I played. And it was like a good 7 years after it came out aswell, so at the time there were a lot of ''fresher'' choices available, but I loved every bit of it.

Yes, with quests, its always quality over quantity, much like anything else.

I don't mind the 'direction' bethesda is going with some of these planned 'expansions'. Like I said elsewhere, I wouldn't mind the one with the war between the US and China in alaska being purely an FPS, as long as it was decently good. Have the war begin with the risk of it going nuclear at any minute, something the player should always be aware of. Have him play dobbs from FO2. The last mission can just end abruptly as he described it, a big flash, a shockwave, and a mushroom cloud forming. We all know how it ends, the fear perpetuated in the game comes true.

Or give the option to play a dumb character whose sole form of communication is 'Matt Daemon'' lol...
Great post man!

I totally agree with you.

I am so diseapointed in Fallout 3.

The first game I buy in many years and it has to be shit. I played it for 100 hours but it still is a bad game that puts shame on the great Fallout games.

I did not agree with most of the critics before FO3 and I did not read anything about the game in order to be as prejudice-free as possible. I play the game, its so-so and the end sucks. Then I read NMA review and I really understand why I didnt like it... Jeeeez
Nice post, though the money pooling is a little far-fetched.

And it seems that the best Fallout sequel op-to-date is the Witcher :P (though it lack the freedom in doing quests.)
Ravager69 said:
Nice post, though the money pooling is a little far-fetched.

And it seems that the best Fallout sequel op-to-date is the Witcher :P (though it lack the freedom in doing quests.)

Yeah I heard it was good. Yeah the bit about the pooling I was being sarcastic (sadly), but if I win the lotery big time i'll be sure to put the plan in effect.

I wonder how much the Fallout franchise is worth. Probably a lot more than it was when Beth bought it, which is ironic as they utterly ruined the series :cry:
Late to the party, but I'll bite. The old Fallout games were great, but many of your complaints are realized in Fallout 3. You can kill kids, help old ladies, or whatever else you dang well please in Fallout 3 and there are consequences to each action, as well. Also, you can play Fallout 3 as nonlinear as you want. I've logged over 50 hours, and I've barely touched the main quest at all. I've actually done quests out of order than the story suggests. No harm done.

As for complaints about Fallout 3, and how it doesn't measure up as a true Fallout sequel, its hard to put much stock in a gamer that openly admits to not having played the game at all. How can you judge something you've yet to experience for yourself?

In closing, Fallout 1 and 2 were great, and so is Fallout 3. Not every old school gamer hates the new direction the series is taking, and not every old school gamer posts on this forum. So don't lump us all together in one big group.
I have now played FO3 and sadly all of my fears and premonitions have been proven to be true.

Sorry, that was my first post, at the time I just assumed all on NMA hated Fallout 3 with a passion. I have now seen this is not true, but the vast majority still do not like it on way or another.

The problem with FO3 regarding morality is it is distinctively black and white. FO 1 and 2, 2 in particular, had a lof of grey moral areas. FO3 its either 'you are a good guy' or 'you are a bad guy'. Period. The karma system has also been twisted slightly for the worse.

If you enjoyed fallout 3 and have managed to play it for so long then I praise your imagination. It must take a lot to ignore the glaring plot holes, the inconsistency of the game, and so on. Beth, with all its immersion propaganda, has excelled in immersing us into their world with graphics. Alas, graphics alone do not do it for some gamers. Immersion also relies on versimilitude, logic, believable characters, (don't get me started on the NPC's) and good story line. Given, FO2's storyline may have recycled a lot of the FO1 storyline, which is exactly when Beth comes and does it YET AGAIN it pisses people of. I'm willing to bet if BIS had done it again people would have been equally annoyed.

And Beth has managed to fuck up a fuckup with a non-sensical ending. They even admited that!

But im curious, if you were to make remake FO3 or make FO4, how would you do it?