Horror Films- What works and what doesn't

[welsh]

Some horror flicks that were supposed to do very well kind of crapped out. Van Helsing, Underworld, Stigmata for example. Others have done suprisingly well, such the Grudge or the Ring. I remember when Blair Witch came out, it blew away another more expensive film in the first weeks.

What do you think makes some horror films work and others crap out?

 

[st0lve]

The sound is what makes a good horror movie.
Nothing else, you can have hot babes making you scared if you have the right sound, trust me, I just watched "Club Dread"

 

[Tannhauser]

Van Helsing was is not a horror movie, unless you count The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen in the same category. It's genre, if I'm not mistaken, is considered Action/Horror, but the "Horror" part only exists because it features some monsters from horror movies of old.

Anyway, Van Helsing's problem is obvious enough, it's just a terrible movie. Plot holes, bad writing, a non-existent story, obnoxious characters, and containing a vain hope that extensive CGI will make people forget all the bad parts.

Carl: You're supposed to die!
Frankenstein's Monster: I want to live!
Carl: ...Alright.

 

[KQX]

The sound is what makes a good horror movie.

I hate it when horror movies rely only on sound. Come on how easy is that? Silence, silence, silence, LOUD NOISE!!!!! yeah ok, people get scared but its so weak and predictable. of course the sound is important but you have to have other things that make up the atmosphere. The best example i can come up with is Alien (1-3): Claustrophobic feel, great story, characters have a meaning, visual effects....I wasn't just scared by some noise that the alien made, it was the whole tension and atmosphere of the movie that did it.

 

[The Vault Dweller]

Ya...I always thought the scariest thing in a horror movie isnt death and destruction. Its dehumanization thats really scary. Being killed by once living zombies is ironic since they should be dead and needing to "kill" them is weird. Aliens mind control and impregnate with embryo's that devour you internally. So on and so forth...

But ya it ultimately comes down to atmosphere as in Alien.

Sincerely,
The Vault Dweller

 

[[PCE]el_Prez]

I hated the ring. Too many plot holes and shit that doesn't make sense. I don't mind supernatural plotlines, but you have to make some attempt to explain them.

Some people seem to get a lot from movies like the ring and the grudge (i didn't see the grudge) but for me: any horror movie that comes out today = crap.

 

[King of Creation]

Horror films work well if there is absolutely ZERO cgi. The less "visual" the horror elements in a film are, the more believable they become. Take "The Grudge." for example. Some simple blood effects, etc worked fine. When that stupid looking shadow cgi hovered over that old woman, however, it seriously detracted from the film.

 

[Flop]

Van Helsing was is not a horror movie, unless you count The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen in the same category. It's genre, if I'm not mistaken, is considered Action/Horror, but the "Horror" part only exists because it features some monsters from horror movies of old.

Anyway, Van Helsing's problem is obvious enough, it's just a terrible movie. Plot holes, bad writing, a non-existent story, obnoxious characters, and containing a vain hope that extensive CGI will make people forget all the bad parts.

I agree, Van Helsing is not a horror movie, and neither is Underworld, if you ask me. I did enjoy Van Helsing, though, which may be explained by the fact that I was actually not expecting a horror movie when I went to see it. I was expecting an entertaining action movie, featuring Dracula, Wolfman and Frankenstein's Monster, and that expectation was certainly met.

Horror films work well if there is absolutely ZERO cgi. The less "visual" the horror elements in a film are, the more believable they become. Take "The Grudge." for example. Some simple blood effects, etc worked fine. When that stupid looking shadow cgi hovered over that old woman, however, it seriously detracted from the film.

That's not necessarily true IMO. Take The Thing, for example, which is one of favourite horror movies. Okay, so it doesn't contain any cgi, but there are plenty of visual effects. I was practically shitting my pants the first time I saw Norris' head detach itself from the body, grow legs, and scuttling happily towards the door.

I don't think there is any single element that makes a good horror movie, but I guess the script is probably one of the most important ones. If you don't have a good story to build on, you'll probably wind up with a piece of shit, no matter what you do.

 

[King of Creation]

That's not necessarily true IMO. Take The Thing, for example, which is one of favourite horror movies. Okay, so it doesn't contain any cgi, but there are plenty of visual effects. I was practically shitting my pants the first time I saw Norris' head detach itself from the body, grow legs, and scuttling happily towards the door.

I meant more in terms of the frightening factor. Pure scare and terror films. The more realistic people think the movie is, the more they think something like that could actually happen. That's what makes a movie stick with people. It's why The Ring and The Grudge did so well...people believed in the fear. That's what I think a good horror movie should aim to accomplish.

 

[The Vault Dweller]

That's not necessarily true IMO. Take The Thing, for example, which is one of favourite horror movies. Okay, so it doesn't contain any cgi, but there are plenty of visual effects. I was practically shitting my pants the first time I saw Norris' head detach itself from the body, grow legs, and scuttling happily towards the door.

I meant more in terms of the frightening factor. Pure scare and terror films. The more realistic people think the movie is, the more they think something like that could actually happen. That's what makes a movie stick with people. It's why The Ring and The Grudge did so well...people believed in the fear. That's what I think a good horror movie should aim to accomplish.

Perfectly said...if the viewer can imagine the situation happening to themselves...thats when they begin to sleep with the light on and watch their back while walking around the house.

By the way Flop your reference was perfect for my explanation of dehumanization. Also I forgot about how I thought "The Thing" is the scariest movie Ive ever seen...

Sincerely,
The Vault Dweller

 

[Flop]

That's not necessarily true IMO. Take The Thing, for example, which is one of favourite horror movies. Okay, so it doesn't contain any cgi, but there are plenty of visual effects. I was practically shitting my pants the first time I saw Norris' head detach itself from the body, grow legs, and scuttling happily towards the door.

I meant more in terms of the frightening factor. Pure scare and terror films. The more realistic people think the movie is, the more they think something like that could actually happen. That's what makes a movie stick with people. It's why The Ring and The Grudge did so well...people believed in the fear. That's what I think a good horror movie should aim to accomplish.

I suppose you're right, but those movies are a different kind of horror movies altogether. I must admit that the ring and Ju-on are the movies that have freaked me out the most, but in terms of enjoyment they don't even come close to beating movies like The Thing or Alien, IMO.

But it has to be more than the realism factor, as a movie like Scream is arguably more realistic than either The Ring or Ju-on (since there's nothing supernatural in Scream), and yet it's not scary at all. I guess it's probably the supernatural parts of The Ring and Ju-on, the fact that when you are "marked" you are completely fucked, no matter what you do.

Btw, I only watched the Japanese versions, so I'm not quite sure if we're talking about the same movies here. I just don't get why it's necessary to do remakes, but I guess that's a completely different discussion.

But I'm not sure if we're really answering Welsh' question here. I get the feeling that he's talking about box office figures as a criteria for success.

What do you think makes some horror films work and others crap out?

Marketing, same as every other kind of movie...

 

[Zaij]

Combination of sound, hopelesness and something to create a feeling of empathy.

The sound scares the shit out of you, while the empathy will transfer to the feeling of hopelessness which will accentuate every "scary" bit.

 

[[PCE]el_Prez]

i really enjoy stuff that can freak you out, without jumping out at you. A fine example is in The Shinning when wendy finds jacks "novel".

 

[Josh]

Combination of sound, hopelesness and something to create a feeling of empathy.

The sound scares the shit out of you, while the empathy will transfer to the feeling of hopelessness which will accentuate every "scary" bit.

Exactly, for me, what makes a scary movie is the feeling of hopelessness. That nothing will be the same again, and you cant do shit about it. Thats why i liked 28 days later, even though if you look at it hard enough, it is a verry bad movie.

 

[King of Creation]

But it has to be more than the realism factor, as a movie like Scream is arguably more realistic than either The Ring or Ju-on (since there's nothing supernatural in Scream), and yet it's not scary at all. I guess it's probably the supernatural parts of The Ring and Ju-on, the fact that when you are "marked" you are completely fucked, no matter what you do.

Well..Scream has the added benefit of horrible acting, a stupid plot, and David Arquette. As for movies like Alien...I dunno, they're just not what I think of when I think "Horror." I guess I'd label them more as Scifi Suspense films. In both of those movies, it was less frightening because you knew that you could win. The alien could be defeated. But in movies like The Ring, you've got no control over the supernatural forces. They're coming for you, and they're really no way to ever get rid of them. The Ring worked well in that while it saved the two main characters, they had to further the cause of the evil girl. And in The Grudge, everyone got screwed.

Oh..I've only seen the American version of The Ring. I haven't been able to find the Japanese. But I've seen both version of The Grudge, and I have to say that I find the American version slightly less frightening.

 

[Bradylama]

Combination of sound, hopelesness and something to create a feeling of empathy.

The sound scares the shit out of you, while the empathy will transfer to the feeling of hopelessness which will accentuate every "scary" bit.

Exactly, for me, what makes a scary movie is the feeling of hopelessness. That nothing will be the same again, and you cant do shit about it. Thats why i liked 28 days later, even though if you look at it hard enough, it is a verry bad movie.

Somehow working towards finding a movie terrible seems counter-productive.

 

[Flop]

Exactly, for me, what makes a scary movie is the feeling of hopelessness. That nothing will be the same again, and you cant do shit about it. Thats why i liked 28 days later, even though if you look at it hard enough, it is a verry bad movie.

I suggest you check out Romero's zombie movies, if you haven't already. They convey the same feeling of hopelessness, but at the same time they're actually good movies (except for Day Of The Dead, which sucked big time).

Well..Scream has the added benefit of horrible acting, a stupid plot, and David Arquette. As for movies like Alien...I dunno, they're just not what I think of when I think "Horror." I guess I'd label them more as Scifi Suspense films. In both of those movies, it was less frightening because you knew that you could win. The alien could be defeated. But in movies like The Ring, you've got no control over the supernatural forces. They're coming for you, and they're really no way to ever get rid of them. The Ring worked well in that while it saved the two main characters, they had to further the cause of the evil girl. And in The Grudge, everyone got screwed.

I agree that Scream had horrible acting and a general alround suckiness, but I don't agree that you knew you could defeat the alien in Alien, at least not the first time you saw it. At the most you know that you may have a chance to kill it, since it's a living being, but that's basically all you know about it (this obviously only aplies to the first movie, which also happens to be the only scary one).

I would also suggest that you dig up the Japanese version of The Ring, if you can. It sounds like they changed the story in the American one. Besides, my experience with remakes (at least language based remakes) is that they're usually not as good as the original. Nightwatch comes to mind...

 

[Josh]

I always thought scream was a piss take, not a serious horror movie.

 

[Malky]

I suggest you check out Romero's zombie movies, if you haven't already. They convey the same feeling of hopelessness, but at the same time they're actually good movies (except for Day Of The Dead, which sucked big time).

Day of the Dead was the best of the Dead films. Please explain how it "sucked big time."

 

[Flop]

I suggest you check out Romero's zombie movies, if you haven't already. They convey the same feeling of hopelessness, but at the same time they're actually good movies (except for Day Of The Dead, which sucked big time).

Day of the Dead was the best of the Dead films. Please explain how it "sucked big time."

Are you kidding? First of all the acting was terrible. There wasn't one good actor in that movie, but there were several really, really bad ones. The guy Miguel, while not the worst, was certainly the most annoying. He delivered the only non-intentional supergay performance, I've ever seen. Secondly, the script sucked. I particularly disliked Bub The Smart Zombie. A zombie firing a gun is just too ridiculous (I really hope he doesn't reappear in Land, as has been hinted).

Why some people find this to be the best of Romero's films is beyond me.