What if Fallout 3 was only unfaithful in gameplay?

Discussion in 'Fallout 3 Discussion' started by Nodder, Oct 31, 2008.

  1. Nodder

    Nodder It Wandered In From the Wastes

    114
    Oct 28, 2008
    What if Bethesda had completely captured the setting, canon, humor, and cleverness of the original FO games, even though FO 3 was still a FPS action-RPG? Also assume that the issues with animation and difficulty level and whatnot were dealt with.

    Even if it's no Van Buren, would NMA FO fans be appeased by that?
     
  2. ShatteredJon

    ShatteredJon It Wandered In From the Wastes

    183
    Oct 29, 2008
    Fucking A I would. That is my biggest gripe about the game. I do not mind the transition to the new style, but the raping of the lore was just too much in my book to be considered acceptable.
     
  3. Black

    Black Vault Senior Citizen

    Jun 21, 2007
    I wouldn't be pleased.
    I'm sorry, but we're talking about a game. If the gameplay isn't faithful, what's the point?
     
  4. Nodder

    Nodder It Wandered In From the Wastes

    114
    Oct 28, 2008
    How faithful was Sands of Time to the original Prince of Persia.
     
  5. ShatteredJon

    ShatteredJon It Wandered In From the Wastes

    183
    Oct 29, 2008
    I would agree with you Black, but I have given up on it ever returning to the old format. So rather than utterly despise the gameplay, I have accepted it. Yes, I do consider this me giving up on my old views. But hell, sometimes you can't win, and just have to go with the flow if you want to be happy.
     
  6. UncannyGarlic

    UncannyGarlic Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Feb 6, 2008
    Sands of Time is part of it's own trilogy and reimagines the gameplay similar to how Metroid: Prime is it's own sub/spin-off series and reimagined the gameplay. It has a lot of the core gameplay elements but presents them in a different fashion (though PoP also is more action oriented).

    Fallout 3 has very little if any of the core gameplay elements and made no attempt to understand or keep them other than superficially. It all fundamentally comes down to it in no way attempting to bring the P&P tabletop RPG experience to the PC.

    That said, had it done what you suggest then it would have been a better spin-off than what it is (though it would still need to be labeled as a spin-off instead of a sequel).
     
  7. Nodder

    Nodder It Wandered In From the Wastes

    114
    Oct 28, 2008
    Ah, and another hypothetical.

    What if there was an FO 3 that was isometric RPG, but it was real-time instead of turn-based? Kind of like what X-COM Apocalypse did to UFO Defense and Terror from the Depths?
     
  8. UniversalWolf

    UniversalWolf eaten by a grue.

    Aug 28, 2005
    I could accept a FP Fallout 3 if everything else was good. I wouldn't be happy about the change, but I would respect the effort. That's a big "if" though, in "if everything else was good." That would mean the game would have good writing, and be faithful to the canon - not an easy thing to do. Real-time isometric would get a similar reaction from me. I wouldn't be thrilled about it, but if everything else was good I could tolerate it.

    Thing is, anyone who respected the source material enough to get the writing and lore correct would probably not insist that a version with different mechanics was a sequel.
     
  9. Tapakidney

    Tapakidney First time out of the vault

    21
    Oct 31, 2008
    I'd be quite happy with it...may even enjoy it more than an isometric sequel. If you took the quality of dialogue from F1 or F2, all the environments, etc, and made it first person, I think I'd have a blast.

    I'd miss the turn based-ness, but I do love FPS gameplay. Even more, I love strategic first person (i.e. Thief).
     
  10. rcorporon

    rcorporon So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
    Orderite

    Jan 31, 2008
    Hell, if FO3 had the same core story elements, as well as proper dialogue, and didn't destroy cannon, I'd like to play it in a first person perspective.

    Sign me up.
     
  11. radnan

    radnan A Smooth-Skin

    622
    Dec 1, 2006
    Stuff like proper dialogue and quests, Perks, the importance of certain stats are all part of the setting as well as the gameplay imho

    So a better setting and quests would have helped but its things like poor combat and mechanics that also are dragging it way down

    its only strong point to me is what remains of fallout lore and setting - i think its so good it manages to make you overlook a lot of the crap
     
  12. SandmanX

    SandmanX First time out of the vault

    16
    Oct 31, 2008
    Abso-fucking-lutely. Mind you, we're not griping about the fact that it's in FPS. We're disillusioned that Fallout 3 has very little Fallouty flavour about it and the fact that it has a more striking resemblance to ES:O (Elder Scrolls: Oblivion) than the Fallout franchise itself. As much as we want to ignore it, we have to face it. In fact, they're not even similarities. They're exact duplicates with different decals, that's all.

    Off the top of my head;

    UI
    They didn't even bother to change anything except aesthetically. It's exactly the same as in Oblivion aside from a shade/hue difference here and there and the fact that they repositioned the status bars (health etc.). Other than that, it all boils down to the same damn formula which made Oblivion a great game, not Fallout.



    Dialog
    Yes, it worked in Oblivion and yes, we didn't mind it in an Elder Scrolls game but this is a Fallout game. WHY does the space/time continuum suddenly freeze when you initiate a conversation with an NPC? It's minor but still, destroys the immersion.

    Character animations/physics
    Seriously, the more you think about it, the more you see how it's Oblivion With Guns®. The above average air time when you jump, ridiculous heights you can jump from and not have your legs break into two, unnecessary gore (yes, it's fun at first but you clearly see that Bethesda was overexcited about this considering 7/10 times you'll blow an appendage off regardless of your weapon power, crazy NPC eyes, out-of-synch lips, deadpan NPC expressions (a single change in tone when receiving sombre news then one question later, POOF! They're happy again!) etc.

    Combat
    Yes, V.A.T.S. is cool and we love it. But why the fuck would we even want to use it when we can just run circles around Super Mutants while shooting at it with a 10mm pistol? If you don't believe me, start a new game. Right after you escape the Vault, get a weapon and go look for a Super-Mutant. Attack it using the following tactics - Run. Shoot. Run. Repeat.
    I can assure you that you'll be able to kill it without using your Jedi reflexes.

    A.I.
    Enemies probably have telephoto lens for eyeballs since they can spot you a mile away and still land a few rounds in you. Kill their friend and sometimes they won't even notice that their partner just had their head shaved clean off by a .303 round. Drop frag mines as they chase you and they'll walk directly into the whole pile despite the fact that you were placing them barely five yards away from his face. Wow. A mile away and you're spotted but drop a mine nearby and they go batshit stupid. NPC pathfinding is quite bad too. Randomly disappearing NPCs.




    I could go on. In all fairness, there isn't even a patch out yet so I'm sure some issues will be addressed quickly (hopefully or we're banking on mods). This is solely my opinion and I do not deny that it's a great game nonetheless. Just not Fallouty enough (or at all even).

    If you scrolled down here and can't be bothered to read this whole entry, basically I just summarized and put forth the fact IMHO that Bethesda's Fallout 3 truly is Oblivion With Guns®.
     
  13. Tapakidney

    Tapakidney First time out of the vault

    21
    Oct 31, 2008
    Quit saying "we" please. The compass in Oblivion was a much-hated thing, too. Also, I'm not seeing much love for VATS here.
     
  14. SandmanX

    SandmanX First time out of the vault

    16
    Oct 31, 2008
    I used 'we' just to be tactful to the people who are fanatical about ES:O and think Fallout 3 is the Godfather of RPGs.

    Truly, I hold much disdain for the whole Elder Scrolls series altogether. I'm glad at least someone shares my sentiments.

    And yes, Bethesda managed to totally fuck up V.A.T.S.
     
  15. JOG

    JOG First time out of the vault

    36
    Dec 17, 2007
    But hey, this time we knew beforehand, right? All I need to know is that it's "even better than Oblivion" and I know FO3 for what it is: a "next-gen" RPG, tailor-made for people that don't like RPGs.

    Neither "Super Avatar Brothers" nor "Moongate Raider" could destroy the legend that is Ultima, and "Oblivion: The Next Generation" won't be able to destroy the legend that is Fallout.

    Don't worry about it, it's not worth the attention. Or speaking in Oblivionite-terms: FO3 will be obsolete anyway as soon as TES:V is released.
     
  16. deadsanta

    deadsanta First time out of the vault

    59
    Sep 5, 2008
    If they'd put effort into fleshing out these locations and making them fun, and stayed true to the load of quests and consequences of quests (and limitations to taking them), then I'd forgive Bethesda quite a bit.

    However, I've played like 30 hours and I've only found a handful of people that you actually interact with at all. And besides Moira and Three Dog, absolutely no-one has a followup quest or interaction with you, at all. Seriously, no one will talk about shiat in this game: Where did Maggie from Megaton come from? Who knows. What's Creel's story? Won't say. Hey you named guy, tell me what's around here? Fuck you.

    And so on. It's not just Bethesda trying to capture some sort of Post-apocalyptic attitude, it's just nothing going on with any of these people, no stories, no problems, no relationships and no dialogue.

    It sucks.
     
  17. Public

    Public Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    May 18, 2006
    Looks to me (after hours studying the game) Fallout 3 looks more faithful to the TES series than to Fallout series.

    If game is not mostly about the gameplay, than what is more important?
     
  18. Ausir

    Ausir Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Apr 20, 2003
    Then it would be a very good spin-off. Still not much of a sequel.
     
  19. Ausdoerrt

    Ausdoerrt I should set a custom tit

    Oct 28, 2008
    Honestly, I'd rather have good gameplay with less canon. As long as it's enjoyable. Or, if you go for the story, make suke it takes up at least 60% of the gaming time.
     
  20. banshee911

    banshee911 First time out of the vault

    33
    Sep 24, 2008
    If the story and dialog were at the same level as the first two I'd have been happy. And what's this not playing after the end crap about? And no summary of what happened to any of the towns you saved/destroyed?

    Yeah there were a lot of things that would have taken less effort on their part than developing a stupid combat system that would have made the game acceptable