Who else REALLY hated Amata?

Discussion in 'Fallout 3 Discussion' started by Tarantulakelurk, May 2, 2014.

  1. Timbus95

    Timbus95 Banned

    43
    May 25, 2014
    Whatever, it makes you grow fast, it doesn't matter in your 19 or 40 or 90, if you want to survive, learn some damn survival techniques and if you can't, a book will help.

    Okay, why is it different... APART from your excuses that it is. It's clear you didn't bother with the links I provided just so your "it's not the same" argument will stand. THEY LOOK THE SAME! WHERE DO THEY SAY IT'S DIFFERENT? WHERE? WHO SAID IT'S DIFFERENT? WHAT DID OBSIDIAN DO THAT SAID THAT ITS DIFFERENT? WHY DO BOTH BOOKS LOOK THE SAME? WHY DO THEY HAVE THE SAME NAME? You complain about me not answering when you haven't answered my questions.

    I mean that everyone here is bitching about "The LW isn't smart enough to deal with this bomb, they're not good enough to do any of these things". The VD dealt with nonsense of this caliber all the time in Fallout 1 and all I see are double standards. Even after the LW gets acquainted with the world, all I see is "The LW shouldn't do this! They're from a vault!" As far as I can see, it's simply because the LW is from F3 which makes everyone hate them by default. "It's okay that the VD could talk the Master into killing himself, but it isn't okay for the LW to talk Eden into self destructing". It's double standards like this that makes the rest of the internet hate this site, and it's easy to see why.

    Yeah, that was "NEWS", I'm sure the people of the CW have better things to do then trek across the desert for something that has a 50/50 chance of working out. Also, you keep bringing up these blueprints, where are these blue prints? It's so easy to say "just get blueprints". WHERE DO YOU GET THEM FROM?! WHERE IS THE LANDMINE FACTORY TO GET THESE FROM? And who in Megaton, a town far from landmines, is an expert on disarming landmines? And the people in Megaton never leave their town, who are they going to find to disarm landmines for a endeavor that the rest of the town couldn't give two shits for? It makes sense to send the new meat on the task as they have no relationship to anyone else and thus will probably not be missed.

    That was an example of being prepared doesn't hurt even if it's unlikely. The vault would have to be prepared. God forbid if the vault runs out of food, "ah well were're dead, we ain't got no survival techniques because apparently we don't need em' because were're in a vault that never opens."

    Well you haven't done well answering my questions, hypocrite much?

    Here are all the questions you didn't answer yet, they're in bullet points in case you get lost:

    - Why didn't the developers DO something that directed it to be not the same book? (And give me info from the game, or developer info, NOTHING ELSE)
    - Why did the developers think that the audience would just know they were "different books?"
    - Why did the developers think it was a good idea to create something exactly the same as something that was already established?
    - Why do the "two different" books have the same name, font, cover style, and the skull on the front? The "creators" of the "books" couldn't do something else?
    - Where is the landmine blueprints located along with the landmine factory?
    - Where are all the computers with survival techniques on them?
    - How can you build a settlement easily without help?
    - Why does the VD get to do unlikely things and get praised for it while the LW gets no respect for doing similar things?
    - Why is Moira unfit for the book EVEN THOUGH she fixes you up when you get hurt and her book is a success if you do well?

    And finally...

    - Why is your opinion that the NV WSG is different make everyone else who thinks otherwise stupid and wrong?
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2014
  2. naossano

    naossano So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Oct 19, 2006
    How your answer is related to what you quoted ? The thing is, people know to survive since childhood. They have no choice. If they don't learn how to survive, they don't even grow up. The book wouldn't add up anything they wouldn't have mastered anyway. Plus, there is also a good chance that the reading skills were forgotten too if not relevant for survival.

    Why are you using the capslock ? We have a different opinion and we arguing about it. I never beaten you, never used bad words agains't you, never been racist, never stole you anything. I don't think it is fair to yell at me like you are doing. If you think i had an unapropriate behavior agains't you, tell it, but don't yell at me for no reason. People are free to disagree and to be certain of their opinion, as far as i know. As a matter of fact, i stated on what ground i based my opinion i did it more than once. If you aren't satisfied with my answers, it is your opinion, but don't say i didn't provided answers.

    I didn't mentioned the Megaton Bomb or even the Master. But if you wish, i will. About Eden/Master, you just basically tell Eden to forfeit and he does during a disapointing dialog, while for the Master, you have to get evidence to point out an actual flaw that currently cripple his plan, was hidden by his lieutenant, and undermine the very reasons he did what he did, all the blood splitted, all the people turned forever into big greens, and all of those who died in the vats. He actually checks the intel and is overwhelmed by guilt and isn't able to face his people again. About the Megaton, it matters when it is the first place you come accross, like the raiders at springvale, that are supposed to be tough challenge, turn out to be piece a cake, at the very beginning of the game. It is the facts surroundings those things that bring to that conclusion. Do you actually think that the people who were disapointed by Fo3 playing purposly in order to say it will be shit ? They came hoping it would be at least average. Otherwise, why bother ? Do you think i will buy Fo4, if i hear some trusted members say it is shit. I won't be playing it, and i won't comment it much, because i wouldn't have any legitimacy to comment it.

    Do you think 3dogs have special powers that let him magically know everything around the world ? The guy has informants that tell things to him. People that purposly inform him. Otherwise, he would have to wait weeks, instead of hours, to learn about rumors, without even be sure of the intel. About the question in capslock (you know what i think about capslock ?), the country was at war by the time the bombs fell and Washington is the center of the governement and the militaries.

    [/QUOTE]

    So we have to prepare ourselves for things that we don't even know it could even exist ? Learn to cook animal that don't even exist ? Learn to fear mutants that don't exist ? How could we know what kind of mutants or new animal we will face ?

    Frankly ? You expect me to answer ten times your questions and then call me an hypocrite ? Be sure i won't even answer new ones.

    Anyway, i will suggest you to take a breath, calm down, soften a bit, and come back when you are more in control of yourself.
    This is what i will do. Because i feel i won't be polite any more is i had to continue.

    At last, i am not NMA. There is a wide range of opinions here.
    Also, why asking to compare events between Fo3 & Fo1 if you already think we use double-standard or if you don't want to hear answers or get mad if they don't satisfy you ? An answer doesn't have to make you happy. It has to reflects what the other guy thinks.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2014
  3. Timbus95

    Timbus95 Banned

    43
    May 25, 2014
    A book will help, do you know how to fix a computer in a world with computers? If you live in a world where you can master stuff so easily why do manuals exist then? I guess we don't need manuals for computers because we can master shit so fuckin easily apparently.

    I'm fuckin pissed because I gave you some fuckin proof the books were the same and you just blew them off because of your assumption "Moira's too stupid to make a good book". Apparently proof doesn't mean shit when you have assumptions. And I really don't give a shit about the different books, if you wanna believe that then fine, but DO NOT say I am wrong when I have the goddamn proof their the same!

    Apparently the proof I gave mean't fucking nothing to you once again. It doesn't help that you think that following the LOGICAL and most STRAIGHT FORWARD thought that the books are the same are somehow the nonsensical reason? I guess if I'm traveling in New York and I see the Empire State building to my right, I should go left because going the "right" way is too straight forward and obvious. And your excuse that they just "reused the asset" loses water when you realized everything mean't to be different from Fallout 3 WAS FUCKING DIFFERENT! I guess Obsidian must of been pretty fucking lazy that they couldn't create a whole new texture for a survival book... even though Fallout 3 already established a survival book... that can become insanely popular if you do well! Oh but of course, the assumption always wins this argument while the logic takes a back seat.


    Yeah, that doesn't answer where the fuck the landmine factory or the blueprints location are, actually tell me where they are if your going to use them in an argument. And like I said, who the fuck is going to trek across the wasteland to go to a town for 5 minutes to tell someone some info that could work on a 50/50 chance when they could, oh I don't know, being doing their job in their own town... to keep it from collapsing?

    How the fuck is preparing a vault that's never supposed to open for the outside world a bad idea? I guess it doesn't matter that they may have to evacuate or anything because... well.. their in a vault that never opens! Please tell me the logic of why a VAULT designed (or made to look like, considering the vault experiments) to save a group of people might not have survival info? And the goddamn zombie thing was used because people PREPARE for that sort of thing. We actually know what a goddamn zombie is, your creating examples of stuff not known.

    I honestly don't give a damn whether you respond or not because I already know your answer: "Moira's too incompetent to make a book, so that explains why the two books aren't the same despite the cover, name, font and lack of developer info".
     
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2014
  4. TheChosen1

    TheChosen1 Moving Target

    Nov 8, 2012
    Wait? You're not in on it? Bethesda Vaults are deathtraps from the start. They were never designed to save people, just to test stupid experiments on. If the "test" was to never open the Vault, then they are going to do their best to remove anything that has to do with survival and then have the Overseer brainwash the vault dwellers into believing that you can't survive the outside.

     
  5. SnapSlav

    SnapSlav NMA's local DotA fanatic

    Jul 1, 2012
    Mostly this. That was my major gripe with the assignments from the Wasteland Survival Guide from the start. But this.....

    I know you're kinda joking, but you're also kinda serious, and I'd just like to correct that, in lieu of a joke ever being mistaken for the fact.

    Bethesda Vaults are all "deathtraps", yes, but this is not to say that the original Black Isle concept of Vaults weren't. Generally, what they differed in was that they didn't focus on absurd, whacky experiments (no FEV injections, no white noise combat suggestions, nothing being monitored by a group of scientists that were "in the know"), but rather they were by design meant to test a social experiment, and almost every single one of them were blind experiments (no occupant was aware of the test), with Overseer Jacoren being a definitive exception to the rule. Stuffing 2000 people into a Vault designed to house 1000 to test the stress of overpopulation wasn't run by a group of lab coats. Populating a Vault with a drastically culturally/ethnically diverse range of people to see how cultural divides would affect the population as a whole was not run by a bunch of scientists. The monitoring was offsite, observed by the Enclave the entire time, and it was under very peculiar circumstances that anyone onsite was aware of the test. Vaults weren't designed to be definitive failures, but scientifically speaking if they were to collapse, this was valuable data for the Enclave, so those and the details leading up to such events were things they wanted to know. The cartoony "evil scientist" tests in the Bethesda designed Vaults were just silly, poorly thought out fanfic-ish writing.
     
  6. TheChosen1

    TheChosen1 Moving Target

    Nov 8, 2012
    I think I've read somewhere that the Black Isle Vaults were there for the Enclave to not repeat mistakes that might have happened in those Vaults due to the experiments.
     
  7. Timbus95

    Timbus95 Banned

    43
    May 25, 2014
    Yes, I'm in on the vault experiments, it's kinda hard to play a Fallout game without finding out about them. And I don't think the "deathtrap vaults" are entirely Bethesda's doing, vault 12 for example was pretty "deathtrapish" in my opinion. But with vault 101, what happens if the vault dwellers have to evacuate or something, what are they going to do? If the vault was never mean't to open, why does the vault door even open then? Why doesn't it just permanently lock in place or something?

    I think the wastelanders do know how to read, it's just the game doesn't focus on that (for obvious reasons). The scavenging for food part could be useful, the medicine part is about how to fix an injury, not see a doctor as that would render it moot. The molerat repellant doesn't appear because Moira was upset that it actually kills molerats rather than simply scaring them off but whatever.

    Just food for thought but I don't get how Bethesda's ideas were more "cartoony" than some of the earlier vault experiments.


    Vault 36: The food extruders were designed to produce only a thin, watery gruel.

    Vault 32: No light bulbs of more than 40 watts were provided.

    Vault 56: All entertainment tapes were removed except those of one particularly bad comic actor.

    Vault 68: Of the one thousand people who entered, there was only one woman.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2014
  8. SnapSlav

    SnapSlav NMA's local DotA fanatic

    Jul 1, 2012
     
  9. Timbus95

    Timbus95 Banned

    43
    May 25, 2014
    Because I'm sure Vault 12 wasn't a "cartoonish villiany" type of thing, I'm sure all the dwellers knew and accepted what Vault-Tec had in store for them. And the logic behind Vault 68 or 69 doesn't even make sense. What valuable "social studies" would be gained from a vault with 999 of one gender and 1 of the other? What "social interaction" did Vault 34 give? Just give everybody guns and see what happens? I'm not saying Fallout 3's vaults weren't "cartoonish", but it's unfair to kick the game like that when previous vaults haven't made much sense.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2014
  10. BigBoss

    BigBoss Your Local Scrub

    956
    Dec 24, 2012
    Vault 68 and Vault 69 aren't even considered canon by many people because they come from Tactics. It depends on who you are talking to, but for what I've seen from the general Fallout community, especially of the past, it goes like this: since Tactics wasn't made under BIS, just as Fallout wasn't either, not considered canon. (Note: This is not my opinion, I have a more neutral stance on tactics, just like I do with F3)

    However, in Fallout 2 we find the social tests are usually minor, not really enough to strike serious mental or physical anguish and damage into it's inhabitants. It was just for the Enclave to pick up bits of data and results here and there for when they resettled the surface, they knew there was no need to go way overboard. This is the way the Vault's were MEANT to be. Keep pockets of humanity away from nuclear bombs, while collecting data to help humanities later progress. Really, the only "extreme" test that took place was Vault 8. The Vault's didn't become a "Unknown to the Vault's Dwellers, the Vault-Tek Vaults were never meant to save anyone..." thing really until tactics, and then Fallout 3 expanded upon that.

    Again, this is where we make the cross over from Fallout 2 to Fallout 3:

    Enclave (Fallout 2): Lawful Evil or even Chaotic Neutral
    Enclave (Fallout 3): Chaotic Evil
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2014
  11. SnapSlav

    SnapSlav NMA's local DotA fanatic

    Jul 1, 2012
    Okay, seriously. HOW stupid can you get? Did you even READ what I said? Because your responses already made it clear you were oblivious to any of the information provided by the originals, that all of your knowledge of the series comes from Bethesda's work. "I'm sure all the dellers knew and accepted what Vault-Tec had in store for them"? WOW. The whole POINT was that they did NOT know. That's the only way a social experiment can be carried out. You don't contaminate the experiment by introducing expectations by revealing the purpose of the tests to them. When I said "the Vault is conducting the experiment on itself", I LITERALLY meant it was conducting the experiment on itself. Note that I did not say "the Vault knew what it was doing to itself", because none of them did. ZERO. The Vault dwellers were placed in a vault that exposed them to circumstances out of their control, and thus they acted accordingly.

    And you think replicating what would happen to humans in the wasteland, but in the controlled environment of a Vault by preventing the door from closing is "cartoonishly evil"? You don't even understand what cartoon villainy IS.

    Just stop trying to argue. You need to bother reading and understanding what other people are telling you before you can disagree. You're just being a brick wall right now.

    Dunno where you got this from. Cause 68 and 69, while silly (that's the point, they were jokes), are canon, and they came from the FO Bible (also known as THE absolute canon of the series), not FOT. They weren't even MENTIONED in FOT. The only Vault FOT covered was Vault 0.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2014
  12. naossano

    naossano So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Oct 19, 2006
    Why i agree with your point, the second sentence of your post seems pretty offensive.
     
  13. SnapSlav

    SnapSlav NMA's local DotA fanatic

    Jul 1, 2012
    I think several of us might agree, independently of one another, having been spat in the face by the same ceaseless ignorance, that we'd all do the exact same thing.
    For myself, there's a finite limit to how much can stomach before politeness goes flying out the window.
     
  14. 5545Trey

    5545Trey Underground Deviant

    652
    Jun 25, 2014
    Have you seen Timbus95's thread?
     
  15. naossano

    naossano So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Oct 19, 2006
    You meant this one ?
    http://www.nma-fallout.com/showthread.php?202187-tl-dr

    I fully understand that it had to be vatted. There would be no way to participate on that linked thread without being offensive at some point.

    I hope that, if the guy come back, he will be more softened. (not the opinion, but the way of talking)
     
  16. 5545Trey

    5545Trey Underground Deviant

    652
    Jun 25, 2014
    Before I became a member of this website, I saw you two arguing. To be blunt, I hope he never comes back. He should just stick to YouTube where most people there are either childish, incredibly stupid and ignorant, or hypocrites. This is coming from someone who first discovered YouTube back in 2006.
     
  17. SnapSlav

    SnapSlav NMA's local DotA fanatic

    Jul 1, 2012
    I am shocked that was ever written. Uh, I guess "thank you naossano" for linking that? It explains why my response wasn't reacted upon with mind-numbing volatile hate; it was, but it got vatted. Did he seriously invent a new thread in which he posted the exact same hateful and spiteful complaining for 20 whole posts??? Wow, that's dedication. @.@

    Well anyway, I don't want a reply to dwell on that. Good that he's banned, shame that he couldn't mellow out to the point that he WOULDN'T be banned, but that's his loss. I don't care either way if he comes back, as long as it's civil. I watched a guy make a name for himself in the server of an MMO I played, 10 years ago, and it was NOT a good reputation. Everyone hated him, and whether you were on the side of the masses that felt like they were being oppressed by the older players with better gear, or you were on the side of the older players who were in control of most of the server's resources, you thought this guy was a baby, an asshole, a hypocrite, or any other number of bad things you wouldn't want EVERYONE to consider you to be. And then he just vanished..... just disappeared, and after a while we forgot about him. Fast forward about 1-2 years, and I have migrated from the side that felt oppressed to the side that had all the power (suck it, Erica Coalition! >8D) and an old buddy on the other side told me in confidence that a player I'd been partying with on my side was actually that universally-despised played from way back when. Couldn't believe it, cause the personalities were night and day, but when I off-handedly mentioned that comment to him, he spoke to me in confidence that it was true, and that this character he'd been playing was his attempt at a new leaf, and that if word got out he was that same guy, he figured he'd get removed from his clan, our alliance, and once again become a pariah, so the secret was kept with me. Long story short, if like that guy this dude ever "resurfaces", but with some common sense, and a degree of decency to him, even if he's hiding under a new name to distance himself from the old, I couldn't care less. I DOUBT the ability for trolls and delinquents to turn over their own new leaf, but like that player once demonstrated..... it can be done.

    Though you'd be surprised what two members have gone at each other's throats in violent argument and ended up fast friends- or at least develop a respect for one another -on NMA, Trey. =) I dare say it happens a lot!
     
    • [Like] [Like] x 1
  18. 5545Trey

    5545Trey Underground Deviant

    652
    Jun 25, 2014
    Although I cannot say the same about YouTube, No Mutants Allowed seems to be a more mature and sensible community.
     
  19. SnapSlav

    SnapSlav NMA's local DotA fanatic

    Jul 1, 2012
    Well yeah, that's youtube. You're just as likely to see people shocked and appalled at how nasty some people can be as you are people reaching new lows you never thought possible. It's garnered that type of reputation for a good reason; it happens all the time.

    It's occurred to me, however, that I feel like addressing "that post" to some degree. I know it's been vatted, and the guy's been banned, but the pragmatic analyst in me that can assess commentary from a detached and non-personal position just feels like dissecting it for perspective might have a bit of value. Just things like "This is how we know that's not true" and listing reasons, that kind of thing. Not just taking a hateful post and getting swept up in the hate and replying back with equal hate. The guy was a brick wall when he was here, it would be even more literal to be "addressing a brick wall" if we were to fall into that behavior now that he's gone! XD Of course, unless anyone else feels like this is worth at least a moment of contemplation, I won't do it. Maybe I'll ask whoever vatted it how appropriate so much as acknowledging it can be...
     
  20. BigBoss

    BigBoss Your Local Scrub

    956
    Dec 24, 2012
    Just read that last night. Wonder why he mentioned Rosh, whose been dead to the internet world since 08. And to the vault comment, it was really only Avellone who confirmed that and a few other smaller developers. At the beginning of the Bible, I'm pretty sure it's says not to take everything they write there in direct canon. I know you're a huge fan of Tactic's, but a lot of the original Fallout community do not consider it canon. Even the man I respected most on here Roshambo, would rip on that shit (along with POS) any chance he could get. But once it was announced Bethesda was making Fallout 3, it seemed like he released all his hate on that subject into pages and pages and pages in the old archives. Go back to the, errr, 2007 area for News comments and Fallout sections and you can see a lot of his rants.

    The guys who made Fallout Tactics hated Roshambo so much they named a that crazy old man after him in the game. Most speculate they did this because Rosh was constantly protesting Tactics on every Fallout site he could find, and the dev's were getting pissed (same reason why NMA was blacklisted from the Fallout 3 features). Though some just speculate this was just a practical joke and had no relation, but.... come on guys.... Rosh beat the shit out of that game on the boards. The whole reason he left was because he felt NMA was to soft on Tactics and Fallout 3. From what Yamu told me, at the time (of development of both games), the news people here were taking a huge neutral stance. Rosh hated it and protested it loud. In fact, so loud that he became infamous to one half, and a hero to another half. But back to the point, he wanted NMA to basically, in their news casts, say "fuck Bethesda, they're going to fuck shit all up" even before anything really official was announced. The way I understand it, he did the same thing with Tactics. But to understand Rosh, you gotta understand who he is. He has a passion/love for gaming, and will criticize your shit to the very last bug. HE had a post in his signature that read one time, not exactly, but something like this: "Bugs can be fixed, but shitty game design lasts forever". Rosh pretty much lived by that esp. being a game designer himself.

    After he got tired of NMA not choosing sides, he dropped off the face of the Earth (if your reading this, hope your doing well mane). But like me, he practically fell in love with the first Fallout. Perfect game design, awesome graphics (which competed with games up until around 2005-2006. Most mid-90's games can't say that about their graphics), not that he cared, but generally he loved Fallout. When Fallout 2 was made, the company was Just, JUST starting to get into trouble, and a lot of the original developers went elsewhere. The major dev's stayed to make Fallout 2. Rosh didn't hate it, but he didn't have the same passion for it either. The reason I look up to this man isn't for his knowledge, but in game design we're kindred spirits (though he would kick my ass around NMA if I said anything relatively good about Fallout 3)..

    First time I came across NMA in the late 90's early 00's, I saw Rosh shiting on retards left and right. This kind of made me ghost ride around Fallout for a little over a decade. The man I came to fear though, was the same man I came to respect. You really should look up some of his posts. I suggest going to the VAT's section, and going ALL THE WAY back. I keep trying to find the original NMA design by Miroslav archived in the net, in which I did at one point, but then lost (a design that was waaaay different from what we have here). But NMA was awesome (not saying it isn't anymore, but it's losing spark for Fallout) when Miro created it. Fallout had pretty much just game out, and people talked about all the little hints and secrets and easter eggs for years, until about 2004. Something happened, which I'm going to divide up:

    1) Roshambo and some other people were pissed that the Fallout title was AGAIN going to be shit on by another "RPG Gaming Company". He led a boycott of sorts and gave everyone the "The British Are Coming!" line in his own way. NMA was divided. Some wanted the website to protest against it, encouraging people to protest Beth, some wanted to take a neutral stance and wait and see, and another smaller group thought it wasn't going to be, and I quote, "that bad". Rosh was basically the leader of that first group I mentioned. The dude's passion for Fallout went unmatched here on NMA, Lost Hills (old community kinda like the Order, whom which they have to let you in, you can;t just get in), and other websites, including the Beth forums himself (which I think he was frequently banned for making the mods look stupid. If Roshambo had any kind of one special, certain talent, it would be making people look stupid. You could be the fucking leader of a Debate team, 10x in a row champion, and he could just out something randomly out his ass and send you with your tail between your legs.
    2) The oldies here had pretty much talked about everything there was to talk about in Fallout. (Just got Deja Vu here), half of it's was on the old forums when Miro ruled, the rest lead up to 2004 (by this time Odin was our new All-Father) and the Fallout section of our community died. Immensely. Not saying this is Odin's fault, but Miroslav leaving us was kind of like being shanked in the back in a prison bathroom, the person being shanked being NMA. Odin's a good leader, and he watches over the site and make's sure things are running smoothly, but he's not actually involved in the community that much. That's really the only bad thing (if you even consider that bad) I can say about him, because other than that, I don't know much about him despite his activity piece on his profile updates only once every month or so. I think he just pretty much left it to the mod's to look after Miroslav's child while he tended to real life. (Wonder where Miro is now, and why he hasn't come back? Did I miss something somewhere?)
    3) The order (originally made out to be a group of giant Fallout fans, now... now I don't really know what they do. They just talk about random stuff now and don't do many activities anymore) became extremely xenophobic of anyone and everyone, and made you hang around them for years before they would think about letting you in (almost like a biker club, or some kind of Monastic Fallout Priests, only they lost a lot of their (Fallouty-ness")
    4) And finally (unless I edit and update this later), we were able to outlast all the other Fallout communities that had more than four-five members. To some people it might be like "fuck yeah, we're the best Fallout community", but what it actually mean's is "Oh fuck, the Fallout community might have caught AIDs from the many other communities it was in bed with (BEthesda, Bioware, etc), and now we have to care for it. I was almost positive that's what the Order was about, but now it doesn't even seem to matter if you're a member or not. Fix that shit Brother None! No, but really, the Order has done a good job, but thinkgs are looking down for NMA as a whole.

    Finally, I don't hate Tactics. I have nothing bad to say against it. I just never could get into it. I try to avoid arguing about it but it somehow catches me anyways.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2014