Why does the West Coast Brotherhood Exist?

Well I'd rather have the security of power armour(as it's described) than to join a mass of cowboys.. Even if you're not getting territory. Because the Brotherhood had an outpost on Shady Sands. By this I mean that territory for them is obsolete. Because they have free passage almost anywhere anuway. Territory ald comes with a high upkeep.

And I would doubt that anyone other than supermutants or the Enclave would fuck with them. As for the hoarding... Maybe they're all genetically predisposed to be OCD at hoarding?

 

Brotherhood is dying, parts of it already being dead, and I believe that most of them (at least senior members) realize it. However, 200 years of collecting technology, warfare, history, exploration and exploitation is indeed a great feat that few have achieved. You can call it a tradition.

Taken all that into account, and the fact that they know that their position under the sun has been jeopardized and taken long ago, BoS still can't afford themselves to just "quit". After all, NCR-BoS war lasted for several decades, and although NCR won due to their sheer numbers, BoS proved to be a though nut to crack. We don't have much information on that (aside from Mojave Chapter), but I believe it is highly plausible that some other Chapters of the BoS are still powerful. Not as powerful as they were before the war, of course, but still a force to be reckoned with, at least by most.

BoS will eventually completely die out, if it hasn't already, but in which way they will disappear is debatable. However, we can be certain that they'll stay strong, or at least, as strong as they can be until the end. After all, there is one crucial thing most people forget.
BoS was found mere days after the Great War, and at the time they appeared, society (or at least, what was left of it - almost nothing) was way different than that which exist 200 years later. Their peak of power has been, and past, but they still remain, which only proves how, to say at least, stubborn they are, and how much they hold to their own traditions, and existence before everything else. As such, stubborn, but blind to the world, BoS will remain for few more years, maybe a decade, but will disappear.

As for their original goal, that is very debatable. One may say their goal is just an excuse for their technological supremacy, or that is because of their religion. Whatever the purpose, their goal has lost its point many, many decades ago. Now, their only goal is to survive as long as they can.

 

I have been thinking that it would really be nice that in a new Fallout game the player gets the opportunity to find a Brotherhood Chapter that isn't merely surviving but also thriving as they either became less strict in the following of the Codex or just gave up on the parts that worked self destructive.

BTW, not the damn 'white knights of the East Coast' mind you.

Rather this BOS chapter has been allowing outside members to join which they found worthy of BOS membership, has active diplomatic relations with the largest settlements.

Sells or introduces some of their more beneficial technologies into these settlements (perhaps having some trade agreements regarding any kind of mechanical industry).

And next to preserving and study old Pre War technology also try to create more of their own, including stuff that has nothing to do with weapons or power generation.

The player would be encountering a paladin from the West Coast who had instructions to locate this chapter and lead them back to the West, he and the Elders thinking that this chapter barely survived like several other chapters.
Much to his shock he finds a Chapter that does really well and over the course of his personal quest he starts to wonder if he should restore contact between them and the Lost Hills bunker, believing that this Chapter might be the best hope for the BOS to survive in some capacity.


In an alternate take the BOS had been disbanded long ago and the Elders choose to blow up themselves along with Lost Hills bunker rather than to let it fall in the hands of the NCR or anyone else.

During the game the player meets individuals who have been studying the old BOS organization or are the children of former members who choose to begin a new life outside the organization when the end was near.

Perhaps with info gathered from them and other sources the player discovers a long abandoned but still heavily trapped BOS bunker that once belonged to the local Chapter.

Once having gained access and full control of the bunker the player could decide to restart the Brotherhood using information from the old data banks.
The player could invite those who are interested in the BOS, the children of former members, and anyone else he/she thinks suitable to join the new BOS and be trained as Scribes, Knights or Paladins.

This would not be a game demand but rather an optional quest, and would result in an ending in which the Brotherhood is reborn and like the earlier mentioned example becomes a major house of research, wisely staying out of the politics of the wasteland while training a new generation of scientists and technicians.

Edit: grammar error; 'danks' instead of 'banks'.

 

Basically what Dutch Ghost said. But Atomkilla, I wouldn't say all of the BoS are dying out. The Midwest and Texas chapters kinda threw out the ideas that were crippling them, the most important one being not allowing new members, and thrived because of it.

Its all about the people in the BoS. Some have kept the BoS under their pillow all of their life, and even with hard evidence, will refuse to give up the old ways. This is most apparent in Veronica's follower mission.

All three of the pieces of technology that you showed McNamara basically says the world has passed you and moved on. I think alot of it has to do with their origins.

They obviously originated(or from around that area) the Lost Hills bunker, which we know is the center of the BoS. Since FNV takes place after all of the other games, I would assume (just assuming here, don't take it for fact) that if they came from the Texas or Midwest, or even god forbid the DC chapter, their goals and ideas would have been much different.

 

Quite possible, though not necessary. What do we know about Lost Hills, really? Over 100 years have passed since Fallout Lost Hills, which could mean big changes for it.
It could, overtime, be turned into quite a literal fortress, which is something Brotherhood is not incapable of.
I like to think it still exists and is still the center of the Brotherhood, though everything is possible.

Indeed, but the Brotherhood as a whole is dying out, their forces being decimated in the war, most of their technology taken away by NCR, their territories occupied.
It is certainty that some Brotherhood chapters are thriving (that is, if you consider 3, Tactics, and that unfortunate occurrence known as Brotherhood of Steel canonical), but Brotherhood in general, its core parts, the Lost Hills Brotherhood is dying out, or is already dead.

Dutch Ghost made an interesting proposition, that some part Brotherhood presses a restart button and becomes a new organization, with new ideology, that isn't so selective, xenophobic and so forth - but would that really be Brotherhood of Steel then?

 

I did not mean it as a reset, more like the Brotherhood trying to re invent itself in a world where it no longer is powerful because of its cache of technology and weapons.

The research house suggestion comes from the ending of Fallout 1.

It would never be the original BOS anymore, but trying to maintain that kind of existence turned out to be flawed.
The rest of humanity did not go extinct, and even with the BOS hoarding some of the best technology for themselves the rest of the wasteland did pretty well without, and even found sources other than the BOS.

They are like a living relic that has outlived its original purpose, and rather than adapting they wanted to regain their former strength by taking away all advanced technology from 'lesser people'.

Much good that did for them.

 

Situation with Navarro was different. Navarro was practically in a black out, Enclave's senior commanders dead, no back up from the out side, many deserting and running of into the wastes and so on.

Lost Hills, on the other hand, if there was battle there at all, would be different.
First, Lost Hills was still a bunker loaded with many advanced weapons - not as many as in Fallout, but still with a significant cache of high tech. Also, Lost Hills was, unlike Navarro, well supplied, their soldiers almost fanatical, with nowhere to desert.
I'm not saying Navarro wasn't supplied well, but most of its resources came from the Oil Rig - on a contrary, Brotherhood had resources, and was probably prepared for a full-on siege.
I'm not saying they would survive that siege (if there was any siege at all), but they would probably be a greater opponent than Navarro.

In addition, NCR was during the war badly depleted. They won the war, but it was a Pyrrhic victory, with many soldiers dead, morale presumably low and with little resources left for combat. Brotherhood, on the other hand, went into retreat, with a lockdown probably ensuing. Although defeated, with a bulk of their forces dead, they retreated because they had seen their chances for victory were low. They went into their compounds, Lost Hills being among them, were they just went on turtling - securing their existence. And when man is with their back to the wall, everything can happen, and NCR knew that.
So, NCR could in that situation attack the bunker, or collect the spoils of war on the surface, slowly returning to their territories in order for them to get back on their feet. They could attack the bunker later, but it's a question of how big interest would it be. After all, I don't see any reason why NCR would want to fight Brotherhood to the annihilation. Brotherhood is no longer a threat to NCR dominion in any way, and that treasure trove was very likely depleted during the war, or has already been taken by the NCR.

As for the self-destruct option - it is highly possible, but don't you think that self-destruction of Brotherhood's HQ would probably mean the complete breakdown of the Brotherhood? It would be a significant event, which would probably cause to the fall out among the surviving chapters and their members, which would later turn them all into easy prey.
I'm not saying it is impossible, but such event, practically a suicide of BoS top, would, and should be mentioned by McNamara, Elijah, Veronica or someone else in New Vegas. Since it wasn't, we can only debate what happened, or what could happen, at best.

Okay, but still - would that re-invented Brotherhood really be Brotherhood of Steel?
Since they would only keep the name of the faction, and presumably parts of the Codex, with all their traits, their tradition and their whole techno-religious way of life would they still be Brotherhood of Steel?
I believe it would be more appropriate for them to take another name, to say that they have roots in original BoS and that sort of thing. Calling them BoS would not be correct since they aren't BoS, just like Shady Sands isn't Vault 15.

 

@Atomkilla

The Brotherhood as a whole would not shut down if Lost Hills ended up being destroyed. I might be wrong on this one, but I'm sure all of the chapters other than the Mojave, have lost contact with the HQ. But even if they didn't, it wouldn't have such a grand effect on them.

 

Well I hope that The Dutch Ghost is right because the BOS is tradmark of Fallout, they are integral part of the FO world and represent many of it's conflicts.
BTW I have my own theory or rather hypothesis about those "white knights" and I find it rather disturbing.

 

Source, please.
I don't know about this, though it is possible. Would give a nice twist to the story.

Maybe not a grand effect, but certainly an effect.
Think of it: a place from where Brotherhood originates was destroyed. I doubt that wouldn't make a big entry in the Codex, and with the Brotherhood's fanatical behavior, none knows what could exactly happen.

Not really. A game without them would do just fine. Very fine.
They may be a trademark, as you say, they be iconic, but they aren't essential. BoS is now a mere relic, a shadow of what it once was. Unless something radical happens, they will eventually disappear, and their another intrusion to the whole story, being powerful again without a proper (logical) explanation could pose a great threat to the canon.

They had Vertibirds, but not enough fuel to mount a whole air assault on NCR forces, since most of the fuel came from the rig.

As for the desertions - why wouldn't they leave Enclave? Many people had families in the Navarro, and many of them didn't want to see them dying to the NCR, so they fled to the wastes. At least there they had a chance for freedom.

Why not just "stay there"? BoS is no longer a threat, or at least not a major one, and NCR certainly has bigger problems than beating up the dead horse.
Even if Lost Hills contained locations of all Chapters, it is questionable how reliable that information is - many Chapters could have been destroyed already.
Also, NCR probably knows where their Chapters are stationed, at least those Chapters that could pose a problem, such as Mojave, so I doubt they would organize a whole campaign just for something like that.
Also, NCR doesn't have the luxury of being able to draw upon their massive population, as evident in their struggle against Legion.

Maybe. The whole self-destruct hypothesis is rather controversial,
with many possible outcomes out of which each and every is highly debatable. That is what is certain, at least.

 

I see them more as an optional faction like Mikael Grizzly has pointed out.
Its fun that they are around but they are not a necessary part of the Fallout spirit.

Still it did make me smile when I found those guys in Fallout New Vegas.

Based on other responses I guess the Brotherhood of Steel should eventually disappear from Fallout and perhaps another high tech organization appear that plays a somewhat similar role.

 

Im pretty sure they'll evolve in some way, if not the main body of the faction then some isolated chapter.
And even if that doesn't happen then we still have the ehh east coast BOS

 

Hardly. Nature's way is that the best adapted survive. BoS isn't well adapted and it can't adapt well.
One way or another, they will disappear, including the Capital Wasteland Brotherhood.

 

Why would they need refueling posts like Navarro or the Remnants bunker if they were powered with fusion batteries or worked with reactors?

In Fallout 3 they explode like the wrecked cars IIRC but...well...Fallout 3...