Fallout 2 mod Fallout Sonora 1.15 and Sonora Dayglow 1.15 Vanilla Translation

[OnlyALad]

The only alternative I could think of is to mark the untranslated dialog as "*unintelligible*" instead of including it in Spanish. That is awkward and a significant change to the original mod though.

Yeah, I do recognize it's a fairly big change but I think it's the easiest way for it to work naturally

According to the wiki, Thelma is based off 'Telma Ferriño', an actress known for her role in 'Sinbad the Seasick'

That makes sense, given the location she's in
Also, thank you for the script thing you're working on, it helps a lot

So far, I have around 7 test subjects, so we'll see how it goes and what they have to say. After some time has passed I'll upload it for all to play (I'm scared, though, I won't lie)

 

[malaise_chalk]

His intention here is that he doesn't care who serves under him. I fixed up the line to this: 'People need authority, that's how their thinking works. And I don't care who gets my orders, just as long as they obey and don't create problems.'

Much better! Thanks for taking the time to explain when I'm off base or missing something, by the way. I'm not looking at the scripts when reviewing, but I'm focusing on dialog I've seen in game so I have an idea of who the character is and how the dialog flows so I'm not too off base.

I've got a few more GC characters for ya:

----

GCCtzC.msg (Frank)

{231}{}{People are talking about you lately. What's brings you here?}
"What brings you here?"

{208}{}{Why so much distrust of neighbors?}
{211}{}{Why so much distrust of neighbors?}
"Why so much distrust of your neighbors?" seems more natural to me, since he's talking about Frank's neighbors in particular, not just the general concept of neighbors. Could also be "Why don't you trust your neighbors?"

{213}{}{You can't trust anyone in this town. Even neighbors will eye your goods. Step outside, and someone will be picking your lock to get into your place.}
"Even your neighbors eye your goods." (similar reason)
"Step outside, and someone will be picking the lock to your back door". (shorter, more natural)

{219}{}{Really? Or is this a cunning plan - steal it first, then offer to 'find' it? But why am I blaming you? You've just arrived, and it was stolen earlier. Okay, if you find my things, I'll buy them back.}
It seems odd to offer to "buy back" stolen goods. Also "things" is odd since we're talking about "it". "Okay, if you find my welder, I'll make it worth your while." or "I'll provide a reward" or "I'll reward you."


{222}{}{Huh? So you're a ranger? Why am I finding this out just now? I don't need the 'law' here! I'm a free resident and won't kneel to you!}
"Why am I finding this out just now?" -> "Why am I only finding this out now?" or "Why didn't you tell me before?". Also "ranger" -> "Ranger"


{263}{}{Ha! Todd thinks he's the smartest one around here. But sooner or later, justice finds everyone, no matter where they are. Okay, pass it over. Here's your }
"Okay, hand it over." or "Okay, pass it to me." sound a bit better to me (very minor)


{217}{}{My welding machine. It's valuable. There are only a few working ones left in the whole city. It provided good income. Now what am I supposed to do?}
...
{240}{}{What do you do, Frank?}
{241}{}{I make statues. They sell well throughout the Wasteland.}
{242}{}{Must be a lucrative business?}
{243}{}{Seriously?}
{244}{}{No, not really. The ruins are running out of stuff to scavenge, and there's little work. I used to work for the cartel, mining and repairing old things. Now, I can barely make ends meet.}

It's a bit confusing to me what Frank's profession is, and whether he was making a good living previously and currently.
* Did he used to work for the cartel (using the welding machine), but has turned to statue making?
* Is he using the welding machine for statue making, or was it just related to his previous cartel work?
* Is statue making a lucrative business? He says "no", but also says "they sell well", implying he's making good money.
* Similarly, he implies that the reason he can't make money is the theft of his welding machine. But if the cartel work is dried up and statue making isn't lucrative, I'm not sure how getting the welding machine back would help.

I realize this uncertainty is almost certainly from the original script. Are you aiming to fix these kinds of problems in your version, or keep it true to the original?

------

GCDeg.msg (Carmelo)

{203}{}{Keep your mistrust to yourself. I'm interested in something else.}
The first sentence feels a bit off, though isn't incorrect. Maybe something like "Don't be paranoid." or "Keep your suspicions to yourself."

{248}{}{Yeah. I had a good nose for useful things. After all, even a handful of junk can be useful. (sigh) But the 'mine'... you know, the ruins, they've run dry, so now I hunt lizards instead of salvaging old scraps.}
"scraps" -> "scrap"

{276}{}{After the question about slaves, you're suspicious.}
Rather awkward. Perhaps "Now you ask about slaves... That makes me suspicious/uneasy/wary."

{285}{}{Buys finds from scavengers, fixes them up, and takes them to auction in other cities.}
"finds" sounds a bit like a garage sale.
How about "Buys junk from scavengers, fixes up what can be repaired, and auctions anything of worth in other cities."

{306}{}{There can't be such a powerful weapon. It's just a bunch of stories!}
{307}{}{You'll visit the cities in the south and see with your own eyes. Although why am I arguing with you - I myself have only heard these stories passed down.}
"You'll visit the cities in the south and see with your own eyes" sounds a bit too knowing about what the player's journey will be. How about "The craters in the cities to the south tell a different story." or "Visit the cities in the south to see with your own eyes."

{297}{}{It's a crazy idea to restore an old factory. A job like that requires lot of energy and many workers. And most importantly, knowledge that no one has now. People can only hope for a miracle.}
"requires lot of energy" should be "requires a lot of energy" or "requires lots of energy". Perhaps "A job like that requires lots of energy and manpower."

----

GCEugene.msg

typos

{103}{}{Sorry, kid, but in this life, only pain and suffering awaited you.}
"Sorry, kid, but in this life, only pain and suffering awaits you."

{195}{}{A lot of bad things are said about you in the wastelands. Are they true?}
"wasteland" (unless the kid is being really stylistically unique here)

{206}{}{On the contrary, I going to free them. What do you know about the attack on Villa?}
"I'm going to free them."

{322}{}{You won't survive alone in the desert, and what's left of the Rangers have no time for you right now. Go back home.}
"what's left of the Rangers has no time for you"

style

{197}{}{That's just the gossip of my enemies. Ignore it.}
Perhaps "That's just gossip spread by my enemies. Ignore it."

{210}{}{Well, this place is getting pretty bad. There won't be any stuff left in the ruins soon. Then the cartel will fall apart, and all that'll be left for the residents will be a life of banditry. I wish I could just get out of this hellhole!}
"… There soon won't be anything left in the ruins. Then the cartel will fall apart, and all that'll be left for the residents is a life of banditry. …" (slight rewording, esp to eliminate "stuff")

{303}{}{Dad won't let me go. He doesn't even want to hear about the Rangers and thinks I should be a scavenger like him. But I'm not interested in digging through scrap metal, I want to repair it!}
This line is a bit odd because there *are* people in Garage City who repair the scrap—isn't that the basis of Kagan's cartel? Frank also seem to be in that business. I'd be tempted to change the gist of this line entirely:
"But I'm not interested in digging through scrap metal, and there's hardly anything left anyway! I want to repair real working machines."

{304}{}{Exactly. Your talents will never flourish here. With the Rangers is where you should be.}
"With the Rangers is where you should be" is a bit clunky, could be "You belong with the Rangers." (that said, the original is definitely a reasonable stylistic choice if that's what the PC intends.)

{329}{}{You know... This journey with you wasn't in vain. I saw so much, discovered a whole world I knew nothing about. After all this, I won't be able to live as before. Someday, I'm gonna definitely go south.}
"Someday, I'm definitely gonna travel south." or "I'm definitely gonna explore the south." sound a little more natural to me. Either way "definitely" should be before "gonna".

{330}{}{Well, that's good to hear, but a little sad. Good luck kid.}
Perhaps "Well, that's good to hear, if a little bittersweet. Good luck kid."

{316}{}{How about a sneaky dose of scorpion venom?}
{317}{}{This isn't serious, is it? Then I'll never forgive you!}
"You're not serious, are you? I'd never forgive you!"


----

GCEugPap.msg

{104}{}{You've made a successful trade. Time to make Eugene happy with this news.}
"Time to give Eugene the good news."

{202}{}{(spits as if by accident) We're not used to sissies here, sorry.}
I'm not sure what the action text is supposed to convey. Maybe just "(spits)"?

{215}{}{Rangers. These vile lovers of other people's goods want to take my most valuable thing - my son. I'm trying to shield him from this stupidity.}
Suggestion: "Rangers. They are thieves in all but name and want to take my most valuable thing - my son."

{222}{}{Life has taught us you can't trust people like that. They just hoard for themselves and share only the surplus. They're the same as raiders, just with prettier words.}
Sharing "surplus" implies that they only keep what they need, the opposite of hoarding. Perhaps "They just hoard for themselves and share only enough to keep the racket going." or "share enough to keep you alive to keep paying up."

{251}{}{Get out, Ranger bootlicker! You won't get shit here except a piece of crowbar between your eyes.}
"piece of crowbar" doesn't make sense. Could just drop "piece of", or do something like "except the blunt end of a crowbar between your eyes."

 

[NovaRain]

A suggestion to party members' scripts (should be six of them) if you're going to recompile Sonora scripts, in their critter_p_proc it's better to change this:

// in FCMer.ssl
if (self_TEAM == TEAM_PLAYER) then begin
   if ((map_var(MVAR_PNX_RING_START) == 1) and (cur_map_index == MAP_PHOENIX_BNDCS)) then begin
   call NodePartyDel2;
   end
end

to:

// in FCMer.ssl
if (self_TEAM == TEAM_PLAYER) then begin
   if (cur_map_index == MAP_PHOENIX_BNDCS) then begin
      if (map_var(MVAR_PNX_RING_START) == 1) then begin
      call NodePartyDel2;
      end
   end
end

The reason is to prevent their scripts from constantly trying to reference a possibly nonexistent map variable when in some random encounters. While it didn't cause any actual issue in game, it would spam the debug log with unnecessary errors.

 

[malaise_chalk]

This is part of the less than perfect writing in Garage City overall - it feels different than the rest of the mod frequently, like it was an early draft version

The farther I play into the game, the more true this seems. The writing definitely improves as the game progresses.

 

[Cambragol]

Okay, as before I will focus on things that are not going in, or need some discussion. So if it's not raised here, it is in!

{240}{}{What do you do, Frank?}
{241}{}{I make statues. They sell well throughout the Wasteland.}
{242}{}{Must be a lucrative business?}
{243}{}{Seriously?}
{244}{}{No, not really. The ruins are running out of stuff to scavenge, and there's little work. I used to work for the cartel, mining and repairing old things. Now, I can barely make ends meet.}

It's a bit confusing to me what Frank's profession is, and whether he was making a good living previously and currently.
* Did he used to work for the cartel (using the welding machine), but has turned to statue making?
* Is he using the welding machine for statue making, or was it just related to his previous cartel work?
* Is statue making a lucrative business? He says "no", but also says "they sell well", implying he's making good money.
* Similarly, he implies that the reason he can't make money is the theft of his welding machine. But if the cartel work is dried up and statue making isn't lucrative, I'm not sure how getting the welding machine back would help.

I realize this uncertainty is almost certainly from the original script. Are you aiming to fix these kinds of problems in your version, or keep it true to the original?

Yeah, this one bothered me. I think I hit a middle ground here:

{244}{}{Ha ha, no, no... just kidding. I used to work for the cartel, mining and repairing old things. But now the ruins are running out of stuff to scavenge, and there's little work. I can barely make ends meet.}

{203}{}{Keep your mistrust to yourself. I'm interested in something else.}
The first sentence feels a bit off, though isn't incorrect. Maybe something like "Don't be paranoid." or "Keep your suspicions to yourself."

Changed this to "Take it easy." - as in chill out.

{276}{}{After the question about slaves, you're suspicious.}
Rather awkward. Perhaps "Now you ask about slaves... That makes me suspicious/uneasy/wary."

What is the context here? The code is a little unclear.

{103}{}{Sorry, kid, but in this life, only pain and suffering awaited you.}
"Sorry, kid, but in this life, only pain and suffering awaits you

I believe this is said after killing Eugene. You say it as you stand above his corpse.

{195}{}{A lot of bad things are said about you in the wastelands. Are they true?}

Wasteland and wastelands is used interchangeably in Fallout 1. 'The wastelands' is normal, as is 'The wasteland'

{322}{}{You won't survive alone in the desert, and what's left of the Rangers have no time for you right now. Go back home.}
"what's left of the Rangers has no time for you"

I think here what's left of the Rangers is 'some dudes', so they --- also implies they are not a 'group' any more, subtly.

{303}{}{Dad won't let me go. He doesn't even want to hear about the Rangers and thinks I should be a scavenger like him. But I'm not interested in digging through scrap metal, I want to repair it!}
This line is a bit odd because there *are* people in Garage City who repair the scrap—isn't that the basis of Kagan's cartel? Frank also seem to be in that business. I'd be tempted to change the gist of this line entirely:
"But I'm not interested in digging through scrap metal, and there's hardly anything left anyway! I want to repair real working machines."

Yeah, this struck me too. I am for making it fit better with the entire surrounding premise. Changed to "Dad won't let me go. He doesn't even want to hear about the Rangers and thinks I should be a scavenger like him. But I'm not interested in digging through scrap metal, patching up junk. I want to work on real machines!"

{202}{}{(spits as if by accident) We're not used to sissies here, sorry.}

Changed it to (spits near your feet)


Okay, everything else is in, pretty much as you have suggested. Thanks again @malaise_chalk and keep it coming!

 

[malaise_chalk]

What is the context here? The code is a little unclear.

Yeah, I couldn't figure this one out either. I don't remember encountering it in the game. That's why I took at approach of trying to rewrite it to keep a similar meaning while sounding less awkward.

{270}{}{Tell me, did a slave convoy pass through here?}
{271}{}{Yeah, there was one. But I gave it a wide berth to avoid crossing paths with such dangerous folks.}
{272}{}{Do you know where the convoy was heading?}
{273}{}{Somewhere to the east. Never been to those parts.}
{274}{}{Thanks. But I still have questions.}
{275}{}{That's it, I'm already heading in that direction. Bye.}
{276}{}{After the question about slaves, you're suspicious.}

Maybe it's just meant to indicate that Carmelo is a bit more wary of the PC after this conversation. Perhaps "(Carmelo seems wary after this line of questioning.)" if it's just a terminating thought to this branch.

Wasteland and wastelands is used interchangeably in Fallout 1. 'The wastelands' is normal, as is 'The wasteland'

. Is there a preferred capitalization? Both occur pretty frequently.

All your other changes make sense. I preferred your fix to the Eugene dialog compared with my suggestion.

 

[Cambragol]

. Is there a preferred capitalization? Both occur pretty frequently.

In Fallout 1 there is no capitalization. I think my translation was a little more loosey goosey on this point. So will need to be updated.

There was the San Brahmin tribe's 'Spirit of the Wasteland' which will have to stay capitalized though.

{276}{}{After the question about slaves, you're suspicious.}

I think this line may not be used at all.

 

[malaise_chalk]

Here's one more batch, which completes Garage City.



GCGate.msg: Gatekeeper

{273}{}{Yeah, I heard. Turns out, you're not as bad as we thought. Looks like your makin' some friends in Garage City.}
{1273}{}{Yeah, I heard. Turns out, you're not as bad as we thought. Looks like your makin' some friends in Garage City.}
"your" -> "you're"

{276}{}{Yeah, heard about it. The Rangers have gone completely off the rails. After this, they won't be welcome any where near Garage City. Pass on that message if you cross paths with them.}
"they won't be welcome any where near Garage City" -> "they aren't welcome anywhere near Garage City"

{297}{}{Once everyone's ready. Check your gear and meet back to here.}
"Once everyone's ready. Check your gear and meet back here."


{222}{}{(raises his gun threateningly) Just show your hands!}
It's obvious that he's threatening. Recommendation: "(raises his gun) Just show your hands!"

{257}{}{Apologies for the gruff. It's just not usual to chat at gunpoint. So, do you allow folks in for the night?}
"Apologies for being gruff." (grammar) Second sentence might read better as "I'm not accustomed to chatting at gunpoint."

{261}{}{A tribe of savages that lives in the desert, but we don't know much about them. All we know is they're cunning sons of bitches, luring weak travelers into traps or ambushing them.}
"luring travelings or ambushing them" sounds redundant. Maybe just "preying on weak travelers"


{263}{}{Why not wipe them out?}
{264}{}{We'd love to take care of them, but we don't know where they're based. Know where their main camp is?}
{265}{}{No, I don't.}
{268}{}{Actually, yes.}

The last sentence of 264 feels like it needs an interjection, like "Say/Hey, do you know where their main camp is?" or "I don't suppose there's any chance that you know where they're located, is there?".


{269}{}{Really? That changes things! Listen, we've got a couple of guys here itching to take those savages out. If you lead them to their lair, we can deal with them once and for all.}
{270}{}{I'm in. Their main camp is due north, along a dry river bed. Just follow it until you reach an old brick house. I'll wait for those guys near there.}
"I'll wait for those guys near there" -> "I'll wait for your guys near there" (minor)


{275}{}{Your reputation in Garage City has improved since dealing with the Jackal tribe.}
I'm not sure what the exact conversation sequence here, but this sounds like a game message rather than something someone would utter.


{363}{}{Ah shit, busted! (sigh) You're spot on, it's a dud. And I can count the bullets left on one hand. What can a guy do?}
{1363}{}{Ah shit, busted! (sigh) You're spot on, it's a dud. And I can count the bullets left on one hand. Go ahead, have a good laugh.}

"And I can count the bullets left on one hand" is odd: it makes it seems like the number of bullets is a property of the gun. Perhaps "And I can count the bullets I have left on one hand." or "And I can count my remaining bullets on one hand."
(or repeat "And bullets? I can count 'em on one hand" from later)

-----

GCImgrnt.msg

{246}{}{Look at these rags - there's nothing to take from us, we're poor refugees. And we have neither the strength nor the desire to work for them as free slaves. They don't need us. So they drove us away like useless trash.}
"as free slaves" -> "as slaves" or "as slave labor"

------

GCLucas.msg: Lucas

{157}{}{... Afterall, you're not going to work for Kogan...}
"Afterall" -> "After all"

{246}{}{...among all the scavengers in the city, I'm the only who can provide it.}
"I'm the only who can provide it." -> "I'm the only one who can provide it.


{273}{}{At first, they were looking for the Jackals' lair, aiming to enslave the lot of them. They need labor for some kind of actual mine. But then Kogan sensed profit and proposed an attack on Villa. An easier target. He wanted to get in good with them. Because Flagstaff promises to be a good client for the cartel.}
"They need labor for some kind of actual mine." sounds a bit off, though I understand the intention is to contrast Flagstaff's real mine to the Garage City 'mine'. Perhaps "They need labor for some kind of *real* mine." or "*actual* mine"

{184}{}{Kogan agreed with a neighboring city to supply parts from this factory. The caravan is already on its way. All we need is to get ahead of it and meet the caravan earlier.}
"earlier" doesn't have any reference. Perhaps "All we need is to get ahead of it and meet the caravan before Kagan does." or "earlier than Kagan does". "All we need is to get ahead of it" is a bit unclear too: does it mean to physically get in front of it, or to "get in front"/preempt of the deal?


{186}{}{This factory is a practical goldmine! You just need to get it working and find customers. There aren't many, but they exist.}
Last sentence feels like it could be expanded: "There aren't many who value what this factory produces, but those that do would pay a fortune."


{190}{}{If everything goes smoothly, you won't be part of it. We'll just meet up with the caravan, exchange things, and go our separate ways.}
"exchange things" sounds too casual. Perhaps "complete the deal" or "deliver the goods" or "complete the exchange" if we want to keep 'exchange'


{193}{}{We need to gather the parts first. Walk around the factory and find the things listed in the contract. Everything listed should be here.}
This line confused me while playing since it sounded like there were multiple items to acquire, and on a list somewhere (which I couldn't find). In reality there's just one item to find, though its description is plural ("radio parts", I think?), and you can't read the contract. Perhaps:
"We need to gather the parts listed in the contract first. Walk around the factory... they should be here."

There are a few other lines in Lucas' and Kogan's dialog that switch between plural and singular for the item at the center of the deal—it would be better to pick one or the other. Some of the other lines include:

{250}{}{Here's the part that was mentioned in the contract.}
{251}{}{(carefully studies the high-tech gadget) Yah, this is it. Get ready to meet the caravan. We meet near the old water pump. I don't know what might happen there, so take a good weapon and wear armor.}
GCBoss.msg:{312}{}{But that's not the point right now, I'll deal with it later. Right now I need some special radio parts from the factory. I need them as soon as possible. Can you get them?}
{331}{}{Great. I'm starting to like you. Now all that's left to do is deliver this to the client.} ("this" vs "these")
{335}{}{I'm waiting for a very important caravan that will begin a new milestone in the history of this city. The caravan is coming for this part. And I need reliable people to protect me during the transaction. Are you with us?}



{229}{}{Old lamps. They run on electricity, which is produced by backup generators because the local reactor has been idle since the "big boom." It could still be powered up, potentially. But that would require nuclear fuel. And there's nowhere to get it, yet.}
This is the second use of "idle" to describe mostly derelict pre-war tech that likely needs patching up. Perhaps "out of commission", or if that sounds too 'broken', "dormant"?


{233}{}{What, the robots? They still won't let us into the rest of the factory. Only thanks to the decoder was it possible to hack the system and turn off the alarm. The robots here are harmless now. And eventually, they can be used instead of workers.}
"And eventually, we hope to use them instead of workers." sounds a little less certain of the outcome, which seems more accurate.


{260}{}{We made the deal! Without your help, it would've been much more difficult. We owe you. Here, take 200 caps. This is your share of the take.}
{265}{}{We made the deal. However, your help didn't amount to much. We talked and decided that you don't deserve a share.}
"We made the deal" sounds a bit off. "We completed the deal" or "We pulled it off!" (first dialog only)


{248}{}{What about the rest of the scavengers? Have you thought about them?}
{249}{}{Open your eyes - Garage City is almost finished. There's no room for so many workers here anymore. They'll have to go to other places.}
vs
{288}{}{There are a lot of unemployed people left in the city. My factory will provide work for all of them in the near future.}
It sounds like Lucas both thinks that not a lot of people will be employed by the factory and that he'll be able to employ everyone? Perhaps he's just lying in the second dialog?


------

GCMotel.msg

{202}{}{Hey hey! Those guys were just hooligans. I didn't want any problems and turned a blind eye to their antics. What was I to do? I'm also a victim of circumstances. But killing guys... Let's just say I didn't see anything, and you just leave, okay?}
"But killing guys..." -> "But killing people..." or "But killing them..."

{232}{}{Almost every establishment in town got something. My motel was packed, they drank almost all the booze at the bar, and Mr. Kogan was counting on some contracts. The city lived off this slave deal for a week.}
"and Mr. Kogan was counting on some contracts" sounds awkward. Perhaps "and Mr. Kogan seemed to be pleased with the deals he was making." or "and Mr. Kogan was making a tidy profit on everything."

{253}{}{Room for one person. Moderately reliable lock. Bedding and furniture included, but don't complain about cleanliness. At night, the corridor lights stay on. The main advantage is protection. No raider can get in here easily, so you can sleep peacefully.}
"The main advantage is protection." -> "The main advantage is security." (minor)

---

GCMotlB.msg:{110}{}{I didn't want to! They took off my clothes themselves!}
"I didn't want to! They ripped off my clothes!"

GSCmptr.msg:{217}{}{(Among the notes, you discover that the raiders were a group of mercenaries from a colony called Flagstaff. Apparently, the enslaved people of Villa was taken there as well.)}
"Apparently, the enslaved people of Villa were taken there as well."

----

GCPit.msg (Pete)

{200}{}{Oh! Salute, companeros! New to the city?}
{210}{}{Salute!}
I'm not a spanish speaker, but it seems like "Saludos" is the right word here, not "Salute", which seems to be a military salute, rather than "greetings!" (I could easily be mistaken about this.)

{233}{}{Wherever the caravans comes from, that's where it goes. Everyone needs the stuff we dig up these days.}
"Wherever the caravans come from, that's where it goes. Everyone needs the stuff we dig up these days."

{294}{}{What do you think, amigo? Trailer... tools... boom! Someone's gotta do it, you know? I'd ask other residents, but I'm afraid Todd will get lynched. I don't anyone getting hurt.}
{1294}{}{What do you think, amiga? Trailer... tools... boom! Someone's gotta do it, you know? I'd ask other residents, but I'm afraid Todd will get lynched. I don't anyone getting hurt.}
"I don't anyone getting hurt." -> "I don't want anyone getting hurt.

 

[malaise_chalk]

{200}{}{Oh! Salute, companeros! New to the city?}
{210}{}{Salute!}
I'm not a spanish speaker, but it seems like "Saludos" is the right word here, not "Salute", which seems to be a military salute, rather than "greetings!" (I could easily be mistaken about this.)

@OnlyALad What's your opinion on this one?

On Garage City's fate

Spoiler

I think it's strange that everyone tells you instantly that Garage City is doomed after Kagan dies. It think it would be much more powerful if people were merely worried, and you found out in an ending slide whether GC made it or not. Fixing this is pretty beyond the scope of a translation, though.

On reputation:
In my playthrough (Sonora 1.15 + Dayglow, F2CE, Sonora + Dayglow DLC + Script Patch 1.04), my reputation per city on the character sheet is often nutty. Sometimes "Neutral" for all towns. Sometimes swinging wildly between Idolized and Vilified for the same town. It seems pretty random. E.g., I was Vilified in Phoenix after wiping out the Red ... gang, but still was able to pass several Reputation checks in dialog trees. Has anyone seen something similar?

 

[Cambragol]

In my playthrough (Sonora 1.15 + Dayglow, F2CE, Sonora + Dayglow DLC + Script Patch 1.04), my reputation per city on the character sheet is often nutty. Sometimes "Neutral" for all towns. Sometimes swinging wildly between Idolized and Vilified for the same town. It seems pretty random. E.g., I was Vilified in Phoenix after wiping out the Red ... gang, but still was able to pass several Reputation checks in dialog trees. Has anyone seen something similar?

I didn't take too much note of that, but what I have seen in my various partial playtesting playthroughs made sense. Though in the earliest version (1.13?) my reputation became villified in some locations, despite doing 'heroic' deeds.

Okay, going though your list, as usual, if not mentioned, it is in:

{276}{}{Yeah, heard about it. The Rangers have gone completely off the rails. After this, they won't be welcome any where near Garage City. Pass on that message if you cross paths with them.}

I don't mind this one. It can be said this way.

{275}{}{Your reputation in Garage City has improved since dealing with the Jackal tribe.}
I'm not sure what the exact conversation sequence here, but this sounds like a game message rather than something someone would utter.

This is a game message.

Kogan agreed with a neighboring city to supply parts from this factory. The caravan is already on its way. All we need is to get ahead of it and meet the caravan earlier

Changed it to 'Kogan agreed with a neighboring city to supply parts from this factory. The caravan is already on its way. All we need to do is intercept the caravan before Kogan.'

{193}{}{We need to gather the parts first. Walk around the factory and find the things listed in the contract. Everything listed should be here.}
This line confused me while playing since it sounded like there were multiple items to acquire, and on a list somewhere (which I couldn't find). In reality there's just one item to find, though its description is plural ("radio parts", I think?), and you can't read the contract. Perhaps:
"We need to gather the parts listed in the contract first. Walk around the factory... they should be here."

Yeah, this was vague for me too. What is the actual part name? In cases like this I like to sync with the actual name as closely as possible. Isn't it 'High-Tech Gadget'?

{186}{}{This factory is a practical goldmine! You just need to get it working and find customers. There aren't many, but they exist.}
Last sentence feels like it could be expanded: "There aren't many who value what this factory produces, but those that do would pay a fortune."

This is good, but tweaked slightly to: 'There aren't many who can handle what this factory produces, but those that can would pay a fortune.' - since the wasteland as whole would value its products.

There are a few other lines in Lucas' and Kogan's dialog that switch between plural and singular for the item at the center of the deal—it would be better to pick one or the other. Some of the other lines include:

{250}{}{Here's the part that was mentioned in the contract.}
{251}{}{(carefully studies the high-tech gadget) Yah, this is it. Get ready to meet the caravan. We meet near the old water pump. I don't know what might happen there, so take a good weapon and wear armor.}
GCBoss.msg:{312}{}{But that's not the point right now, I'll deal with it later. Right now I need some special radio parts from the factory. I need them as soon as possible. Can you get them?}
{331}{}{Great. I'm starting to like you. Now all that's left to do is deliver this to the client.} ("this" vs "these")
{335}{}{I'm waiting for a very important caravan that will begin a new milestone in the history of this city. The caravan is coming for this part. And I need reliable people to protect me during the transaction. Are you with us?}

This was confusing too me too, and I think I actually mixed up 'Radio Parts' and 'High-Tech Gadget' - Have gone with the latter now, and tweaked all lines to reflect this.

{233}{}{What, the robots? They still won't let us into the rest of the factory. Only thanks to the decoder was it possible to hack the system and turn off the alarm. The robots here are harmless now. And eventually, they can be used instead of workers.}

This is confusing to me. Are the robots dangerous or not? Because if they are not, how can they be preventing them from entering the rest of the factory. How about this:
"{233}{}{What, the robots? They wouldn't even let us into factory at first. It was only thanks to the decoder that we were able to hack the system and turn off the security. The robots here are harmless now. And eventually, we hope to use them instead of workers.}"

{248}{}{What about the rest of the scavengers? Have you thought about them?}
{249}{}{Open your eyes - Garage City is almost finished. There's no room for so many workers here anymore. They'll have to go to other places.}
vs
{288}{}{There are a lot of unemployed people left in the city. My factory will provide work for all of them in the near future.}
It sounds like Lucas both thinks that not a lot of people will be employed by the factory and that he'll be able to employ everyone? Perhaps he's just lying in the second dialog?

I made these two lines match up better:

{249}{}{Open your eyes - Garage City is almost finished. There's just not enough work, or junk, for the scavengers here anymore. They'll have to go somewhere else.}

{288}{}{There are a lot of scavengers without work left in the city. My factory will provide work for all of them in the near future. We could also provide your Villa with various services at a very low cost. You'll restore the village, strengthen your lands, and we'll earn a little money, or, corn I guess. And more importantly, we'll avoid neighborly 'conflicts'.}

I'll tackle the others tomorrow. Good stuff all around. Thanks again!

 

[OnlyALad]

@OnlyALad What's your opinion on this one?

I do agree, if you want to change it to spanish, "¡Saludos!" or just "¡Hola!" would work, the second is most commonly used; I thought Pete using a military salute was intentional. (though if I understood your message correctly, "salute" does exist in spanish but it's used for a very specific coin, I've never seen or heard it used as a greeting)

 

[malaise_chalk]

Yeah, this was vague for me too. What is the actual part name? In cases like this I like to sync with the actual name as closely as possible. Isn't it 'High-Tech Gadget'?

I just loaded an old save to verify, and that's exactly the right name.

Nice fixes overall!

I do agree, if you want to change it to spanish, "¡Saludos!" or just "¡Hola!" would work, the second is most commonly used; I thought Pete using a military salute was intentional. (though if I understood your message correctly, "salute" does exist in spanish but it's used for a very specific coin, I've never seen or heard it used as a greeting)

Interesting… you normally wouldn't say "Salute!" in english unless you were speaking very idiosyncractically or demanding that your interlocutor should salute _you_, so I had assumed this was an attempt at a greeting in Spanish, especially:
"Salute, companeros!"

This is one that has a Hot headed translation, so we can compare english to what the spanish should translate to:

{199}{}{Oh! �Greetings, friend!� New to the city?}
{200}{}{Oh! Salute, companeros! New to the city?}

So almost certainly not a military salute. (though, again shouldn't it be "compañero" since you're alone?)

 

[malaise_chalk]

A few more observations from the playthrough


Phoenix

PCMerkBs.msg
{424}{}{Yes. I'm here to claim the bounty Eydie Gorme}
{429}{}{Eydie Gorme is dead. Unfortunately, I left her head somewhere out in the wasteland.}
PSMerkAd.msg
{238}{}{Aidy Gorme.}
{239}{}{[Crossed out] Aidy Gorme.}
scrname.msg
{499}{}{Eydie Gorme}
I'm assuming that Eydie is correct, not Aidy, as a reference to the real Eydie Gorme

PCBdDed.msg:{201}{}{Sort of. Do you actually live here?}
PCBdDed.msg:{202}{}{(groaning with dissatisfaction) Yeah, this is a community house, and this is my room.}
Not sure what the groaning is about. Perhaps "(grunts with displeasure)"?


PCRngBos.msg:{228}{}{In that case, I have a proposal - I want to try my hands in the fights.}
PCTrener.msg:{255}{}{Ah, the new champion. (He looks you over again, sizing you up.) I don't get why you're in the fights, but at least you seem like a decent guy. (raises his bottle) Cheers.}
"in the fights" sounds odd. "in the ring" would be a good substitute in the first dialog, "you're competing" or "you're fighting in the ring" in the second (Iron Mike)

PCMaster.msg{370}{}{The common populace has fallen to the level of animals and is incapable of participating in the great cause of Rebirth voluntarily. Slavery is merely a necessary and temporary means for our mission. Besides, we never enslaved anyone ourselves, only paid mercenaries for their work, turning a blind eye to their brute measures.}

It doesn't seem realistic that Aaron would just spurt out that they are turning a blind eye to the mercenaries' brutality so plainly. The last sentence could be "Besides, we never enslaved anyone ourselves: we pay mercenaries to do the dirty work."
Also first sentence could be slightly improved to "The common populace has fallen to the level of animals and is incapable of voluntarily participating in the great cause of Rebirth"

PCBdNark.msg:{200}{}{(shuddering as if in a fever) W-what do you want?}
"in a fever" doesn't quite parse for me. Maybe "([visibly] shuddering and sweating) ..." or "(shuddering feverishly) ..."

----

Casa Grande


DCWtrBos.msg John Sullivan

(after the incident where the water merchant was attacked by a townsperson)

{300}{}{I know what went down at the merchant's place. Poverty makes folks do crazy things.}
{301}{}{Are you threatening me?}
{302}{}{If you've got any sense, you'll stay quiet. We've got a reputation to protect.}

{301} feels like a non-sequitur. There should be at least an implied threat in {300} to merit that response (and yes, these come in that exact order). Feels like you could just skip the 301 dialog entirely, or add something like "I *trust* you know the right way to handle this situation." to 300


John Sullivan also breaks a bit if you don't speak with him at all before the incident occurs. In the case when you only speak to him _after_ the incident, you get his initiate dialog tree with no mention of the incident. Then you might (say) repair the water pump, then speak with him again, in which case he jumps to the {300} line above, which is jarring, because you were in the middle of talking to him about the pump. This was especially baffling to me while playing because the incident occurred offscreen so I had no idea what he was talking about. I'm not sure how to naturally fix this… seems like it would require some script finessing and not sure how often it would be likely to occur in practice.

I reloaded a save and the incident itself was strange The dialog makes sense, but then the attacker pulled out the sledgehammer and proceeded to run away instead of attacking the water merchant. Is that supposed to happen?



DCAlien.msg (newcomer)

There is some dialog tree logic amiss here. I got the following dialog option before knowing that the bathhouse owner was the "newcomer's" uncle, or even family/kin. I have a save that can repro this (and the John Sullivan thing above) if helpful.
{215}{}{Well well... Any leads on your uncle from the locals?}

{218}{}{Beats me. Hanging around a bit longer, hoping my Uncle decides to show. If you hear anything, give me a holler, alright? I'll be in your debt.}
"Uncle" -> "uncle" (matches rest of dialog)


DSBthRpr.msg:{114}{}{The heater is not working. Local residents damaged the boiler room when they robbed the place.}
It's a bit strange to see this description when first visiting the bathhouse. How would the PC know who broke the boiler? At this point I had no idea what happened to the bath house proprietor. Perhaps change to "Looks like it was damaged by looters."


{42100}{}{Railway Traffic Light}
{42101}{}{Another ancient object of unknown purpose.}
This is a pretty minor one, but the object outside of town has a very clear name. But the description implies you have no idea what it is. Fallout isn't always consistent in telling you only what you "should" know in item descriptions, but this felt like quite an odd juxtaposition.


Gallegos
DCCtznE.msg:{298}{}{�An old wound. What do you care? Do you like to make fun of others?�}
...
DCCtznE.msg:{314}{}{�It's a shame that this happened. Tell me how it happened? I promise this'll stay between us.�}
A lot of "happened", and awkward articles. How about "I'm sorry. How did it happen? I promise this'll stay between us." or "That's a shame..."

 

[Cambragol]

Okay, carrying on with your comments:

John Sullivan also breaks a bit if you don't speak with him at all before the incident occurs. In the case when you only speak to him _after_ the incident, you get his initiate dialog tree with no mention of the incident. Then you might (say) repair the water pump, then speak with him again, in which case he jumps to the {300} line above, which is jarring, because you were in the middle of talking to him about the pump. This was especially baffling to me while playing because the incident occurred offscreen so I had no idea what he was talking about. I'm not sure how to naturally fix this… seems like it would require some script finessing and not sure how often it would be likely to occur in practice.

I reloaded a save and the incident itself was strange The dialog makes sense, but then the attacker pulled out the sledgehammer and proceeded to run away instead of attacking the water merchant. Is that supposed to happen?

I'm pretty sure he is supposed to attack the water merchant. I guess he chickened out..? Haha, well there could be other factors involved there.

For the dialogue, I guess you are saying that Sullivan should address the incident immediately, even if it is the first time talking to him? Because I can fix this in code, if I know what we want to happen clearly.

Is this better for the dialogue? :
{300}{}{I know what went down at the merchant's place. Poverty makes folks do crazy things.}
{301}{}{What's that supposed to mean?}
{302}{}{If you've got any sense, you won't mention it. We've got a reputation to protect.}

There is some dialog tree logic amiss here. I got the following dialog option before knowing that the bathhouse owner was the "newcomer's" uncle, or even family/kin. I have a save that can repro this (and the John Sullivan thing above) if helpful.
{215}{}{Well well... Any leads on your uncle from the locals?}

{218}{}{Beats me. Hanging around a bit longer, hoping my Uncle decides to show. If you hear anything, give me a holler, alright? I'll be in your debt.}
"Uncle" -> "uncle" (matches rest of dialog)

I changed line 210 to this:
{210}{}{He's my uncle. Got a letter inviting me to come work there. So, here I am. But he's vanished.}

Then commented out access to this line in the script:
{215}{}{Well well... Any leads on your uncle from the locals?}
Prior to getting to the node for line 210.
So this should fix it.

{42100}{}{Railway Traffic Light}
{42101}{}{Another ancient object of unknown purpose.}
This is a pretty minor one, but the object outside of town has a very clear name. But the description implies you have no idea what it is. Fallout isn't always consistent in telling you only what you "should" know in item descriptions, but this felt like quite an odd juxtaposition.

Very true. Changed to:
{42100}{}{Railway Traffic Signal}
{42101}{}{Another relic of the Old World.}

Okay, everything else is in as per your suggestions. Very nice. Thanks again for all the input. I can feel the polish.

 

[dogidogi]

Hey so sorry if this has already been answered but i dont really know how to browse this forum and i did not find anything on ModDB - How do i change the game's resolution? Im using the improved Fallout 2 CE linked on moddb (im the person who commented about dead links the other day). Also, would mods like the inventory sorter and other tweaks work?

 

[Cambragol]

Hi dogidogi,

Unzip the attached file and use the ini files with Fallout 2 CE. Drop them (and f2_res.dat) into the directory with Fallout 2 CE. All the ini settings in these versions can be tweaked in Fallout 2 CE.

Resolution is set in F2_res.ini:

; Set SCALE_2X=1 to scale the game x2.
; Note: This will increase the minimum resolution to from 640x480 to 1280x960.
SCALE_2X=0

; Set the Fullscreen resolution here.
SCR_WIDTH=800
SCR_HEIGHT=500

; Set WINDOWED=1 to enable windowed mode.
WINDOWED=1


That should set you straight.

Also, would mods like the inventory sorter and other tweaks work?

Generally, no, unless you can find a setting in the ddraw.ini I provided. It's best to just play it vanilla. You will have less crashes and headaches.

 

[malaise_chalk]

I'm pretty sure he is supposed to attack the water merchant. I guess he chickened out..? Haha, well there could be other factors involved there.

Perhaps! It kinda of works too—he's mad, but not inherently violent, and doesn't have the stomach for violence. Unfortunately this just means that they chase each other around the map until you decide to kill one of them (that works though).

For the dialogue, I guess you are saying that Sullivan should address the incident immediately, even if it is the first time talking to him? Because I can fix this in code, if I know what we want to happen clearly.

I think that could work. So if you haven't spoken to him and he incident happens, the first dialog would be {300}-{311}, which would then end. Then the next time you spoke, you'd have the "intro" dialog:

{200}{}{Hey, stranger. I don't like strangers messing around on my property.}
{1200}{}{Aw, lady, what a surprise to see a lady here. Although I don't usually like strangers hanging around on my property.}
{201}{}{Is this your water pump? Do you own it?}
{202}{}{It is and I do. I'm John Sullivan. And I own this entire pump. Do you have business with me? If not, then step outside. I need to fix this filter, not chat with strangers.}

I think that still works even if you'd technically "met" him before.

Another option could be to change {300} to:
{300}{}{By the way, I know what went down at the merchant's place. Poverty makes folks do crazy things.}

That make it seem less jarring if it occurs between two of his "normal" dialog tree, though might seem more awkward if you haven't spoken to him in a while.

{300}{}{I know what went down at the merchant's place. Poverty makes folks do crazy things.}
{301}{}{What's that supposed to mean?}
{302}{}{If you've got any sense, you won't mention it. We've got a reputation to protect.}

That's great! A better solution that what I was thinking of.

I can feel the polish.

Thanks! It's a testament to the quality of your work thus far. I think a very high level of quality is pretty reachable and feel motivated to help get there.

What're your plans for the English release? I think I saw you mention of consolidating into a single version instead of 3 (which makes sense). Are you thinking of still trying to keep up with new versions of Sonora?

 

[Cambragol]

Another option could be to change {300} to:
{300}{}{By the way, I know what went down at the merchant's place. Poverty makes folks do crazy things.}

I think this will be the way to go. I'd rather not mess with the scripts in cases where it is not necessary. This keeps the original logic, but smooths the transition.

Currently the English release aims to be a single combined English version, so a repacked master.dat, English as the main language, Russian or other languages (Spanish) in subfolders. Various reasons for that, but mainly stem from maintenance and making it easy for players to get onto playing. Secondary is a desire to lift Sonora to the level of Fallout 1 and 2, meaning a 'stand alone' game, rather than a mod *for* Fallout 2. A game that itself, could be modded. I guess my work on Fallout 2 CE is part of that as well, though there is a desire to make Fallout work flawlessly on macOS (and elsewhere) as well.

Thereafter, if my energy lasts, I'd like to add more polish to the game itself, diverging from the Russian version in some ways. The opening, talking heads, proper elevators, missing content, improved/expanded dialogue, are all things I might consider. Things that could really lift it to the level of Fallout 1/2 (not that it isn't nearly there already).

I would certainly keep up with and incorporate any improvements/updates from Nevada Band. Though, with the scripts version of my translation enabled, we are already looking at 1.16 or 1.17 of the game. There are a lot of improvements/fixes that the Russian version still lags behind on. My tree pass through all the scripts allowed me to implement more than a 100 changes/improvements/fixes, which is more than the average update. Still, it is their creation, so I'd work it in, just like I did with the 1.15 update (which was a doozy... so many scripts had to be spliced together, and carefully)

 

[malaise_chalk]

Currently the English release aims to be a single combined English version, so a repacked master.dat, English as the main language, Russian or other languages (Spanish) in subfolders. Various reasons for that, but mainly stem from maintenance and making it easy for players to get onto playing. Secondary is a desire to lift Sonora to the level of Fallout 1 and 2, meaning a 'stand alone' game, rather than a mod *for* Fallout 2. A game that itself, could be modded. I guess my work on Fallout 2 CE is part of that as well, though there is a desire to make Fallout work flawlessly on macOS (and elsewhere) as well.

This makes a lot of sense to me. Almost certainly the biggest obstacle to getting people to try it is how finicky it is to get running. It's not super complicated, but dragging things into the right folders and downloading from sketchy-seeming russian sites is a bit much for most. Happy to help with that, especially testing. Are you thinking of embedding F2CE? Having a single installer for all of Sonora that just works would be incredible. (Also, you could ship it with settings that work well with Sonora, perhaps even UI/QoL settings turned on that the maintainers of F2CE might not want to make the default.)

Thereafter, if my energy lasts, I'd like to add more polish to the game itself, diverging from the Russian version in some ways. The opening, talking heads, proper elevators, missing content, improved/expanded dialogue, are all things I might consider. Things that could really lift it to the level of Fallout 1/2 (not that it isn't nearly there already).

To me, I think the questing and areas in Sonora feels more polished that F1/2 (which were relatively buggy, and F2 especially had pretty unfinished areas), though the writing is still one notch below F1/F2 (esp F1). There are very few typos, few enough to drop below the perceptual threshold where they are distracting (which is great). I still regularly encounter awkward phrasing that makes the text feel more like a translation than natively written dialog, which is a bit immersion breaking. That's the main type of problem I'm trying to find when reviewing.

I guess my work on Fallout 2 CE

F2CE has so much potential, and I'm eager to contribute to that too now that I've found a version that is actively being maintained.

 

[Cambragol]

Almost certainly the biggest obstacle to getting people to try it is how finicky it is to get running. It's not super complicated, but dragging things into the right folders and downloading from sketchy-seeming russian sites is a bit much for most.

100%. Which is sad, because this is the mod/game every Fallout fan needs and wants to play. I would most likely want to ship it with an embedded Fallout 2 CE (maybe not on first release, but then again, maybe.) A mac version could even have Sonora embedded inside the Fallout 2 CE app, for extra polish (at least on mac). A custom version of Fallout 2 CE with specific settings/UI features was my plan too (I was originally thinking a hard-coded 800x500 version, but have since softened on that as it seems so many people just have to have that extra screen real estate, even if it make the PC and NPCs look like dots)

To me, I think the questing and areas in Sonora feels more polished that F1/2 (which were relatively buggy, and F2 especially had pretty unfinished areas), though the writing is still one notch below F1/F2 (esp F1).

100%. I realised on my first aborted play-through that the coding, sound and art was equal to or beyond Fallout 1/2, which was what set me on the path of getting the translation up to that level. Still working on that, and I have to agree that in many places the whole presentation of the English version suffers from a Russian 'framing' that is hard to break free of without significantly parting from the original translation. To be honest though, I felt (originally) that some awkwardness could come naturally as part of realistic language/cultural changes of a post-apocolyptic world, 150 yeas in the future. However... Fallout 1's language, the more I look at it, is just 90s English. You are just interacting with colorful 90s characters, who communicate like they just hoped out of a your average North American city.
So, continued polish is great. (it was also my nefarious plan to leverage players feedback to get the translation quality up to the highest level possible, while keeping my own critical eye on the final product)

Happy to help with that, especially testing.

I'm eager to contribute to that too now

Awesome.