According to The Escapist's Extra Credits...

Discussion in 'Fallout: New Vegas Discussion' started by OakTable, May 8, 2011.

  1. OakTable

    OakTable Vault Senior Citizen

    Nov 26, 2009
    Well, Blatherscythe, I can safely say you need to calm down. Deploying kittens.

    Anyway, I guess I can tell my reasoning for not e-mailing the guy or posting on his forums and, "going to a site which shares my hatred".

    1. People have already pointed this out to him. Although the Escapist forums is filled with idol worship like every forum is (Yes, even ours. Don't fucking act like you wouldn't blow Tim Cain or Chris Avellone if you saw them), people have told him that the Courier has no amnesia, starts with stuff based on his skills, and has Traits that can be used to imagine a back story. However, he kind of just blew them off, and said, "Yeah, whatever, Fallout 3 still has a better story because hiking and getting Bible quotes from your fake Dad is like the most immersive shit ever," and then ran off and began writing more pretentious stuff.

    2. Developers almost never read e-mails or their forums. No matter how indy this guy is (I looked up his company on Google. No results), he still is a developer, and they almost never respond to e-mails. Folks like Joshua Sawyer, a guy who likes taking time out of the day to clarify and discuss issues with his game, are rare in the industry. People take either the BioWare approach (Bitch about people being meanies and retreating into their hugboxes while their fans berate people who have opinions different than theirs), Bethesda approach (Never say anything to anyone, and let the fans do the bitching for them), or Eidos Montreal (Deus Ex: Human Revolution devs) approach (Only change something when outstanding criticism is aimed towards them, and cry about having to change their game). This idea IS shared among indy devs, as I remember Sawyer responding to an Indy dev who said he never reads his forums.
  2. Briosafreak

    Briosafreak Lived Through the Heat Death

    Dec 18, 2003
    New Vegas has a three act structure since the beginning. That's how Avellone and most of Obsidian works, everyone knows that. In the classic games it was like that too, we develop the character and discover the world in act I, there's an unexpected twist in the second act, and a tense conclusion in the third act.

    So I call that piece bullshit.
  3. freduardo

    freduardo First time out of the vault

    Nov 12, 2008
    Granted: Fallout 3's story sucked overall. It was trite, aside from the side-missions there was hardly any of it and it was totally your standard blank-slate-hero's-journey except with a few of the staples removed.

    However, the (useful) point of the video's comparison was between the tutorials. New Vegas' tutorial is somewhere between completely forced and a mini-ripoff of F3's, and F3's tutorial very likely changed the way people think about introducing games.

    It wasn't the bible quotes, it wasn't the birthday party, and it wasn't the little radroach shoot near the reactor. It was the fact that you could actually play through some of your character's formative years and got the chance to make an emotional attachment to other characters who showed up again in a way rarely seen in a game. It gave you a backstory but in a mostly interactive way. On a sadder note, it totally failed to follow through with that kind of commitment in the larger game, and that's why NV is a better game than F3 with overall a better story. But I think the point on the tutorials stands.
  4. OakTable

    OakTable Vault Senior Citizen

    Nov 26, 2009
    If only Bethesda did something interesting with the growing up thing, instead of the whole, "Your dad loves you, Amata likes you, Butch hates you" shit you're stuck with. It would've been cool if you picked on Amata when she was younger, she wouldn't tell you that her father was trying to kill you and you would walk into like 3 security guards or something. But nope, apparently it's super-IMMURSHIVE just the way it is= according to game journalists.
  5. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    Its immersive, write it properly :V
  6. Faceless Stranger

    Faceless Stranger Board Drifter

    Aug 19, 2010
    Everybody knows that immurshun = doing the exact same thing every time you start a new game.

  7. AWildmann

    AWildmann It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Sep 12, 2010
    In the matter of knowing people that like you and learn about the world, and then losing them, you could point out several games that did a better job with a tutorial.

    One I enjoyed for example was Kingdom Hearts 1 for ps2 (I know, completely off from FO). You met everyone in the island, helped them, knew the love interest, and in a sudden event everything was lost.

    For me, Fallout 3 tutorial wasn't very good because, no matter the choices you had, for choosing to beat up Butch or not, to kill the Overseer or not, there was no difference other than a response from Amata. And she would still help you out after that. So this means that your choices are pointless.

    In Goodsprings, if you choose to help the Powdergangers or not, not only you will be choosing if the town lives right away, due to people hating you or loving you, there will also be conseguences in the ending. So for me thats a good tutorial.
  8. Ilosar

    Ilosar Vault Fossil

    Apr 20, 2010
    Even the people on The Escapist dismiss him. Just leave the sorry man alone.
  9. OakTable

    OakTable Vault Senior Citizen

    Nov 26, 2009
    Alrighty then.

    However, having read that Escapist thread, I can say that I probably shouldn't have typed that OP in that tone. Sorry for being a bit rude, Escapist fellows.
  10. pall

    pall First time out of the vault

    May 3, 2011
    arguments stated here are good, But anger can be more hurtful to prove our point
    Now let somebody from here go to escapist tread and explaing to them why that guy was wrong using only logical arguments and in-game examples.
  11. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    wow, how old is he? like 13 or something? somebody makes a toic you don't like on a forum so you go to the forum to tell them about this terrible people having a diferent oinion, talk about fagotry (no offense to gay people)
  12. Faceless Stranger

    Faceless Stranger Board Drifter

    Aug 19, 2010
    So that's where Blatherscythe came from.... huh...
  13. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    He als ocommented that he was gonna make a troll account to piss us off, so thats where that unimagiantive "fallout3ftw" account came from... not that is surprising in the least.
  14. Wintermind

    Wintermind Vault Senior Citizen

    Jan 21, 2011
    Never take the escapist seriously. Use it for laughs only. And by that I mean Unskippable or Zero Punctuation. Or occasionally perusing their 'forums'.
  15. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    AH, is The Escapist where that unfunny Yathzee guy comes from? explains a lot.
  16. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Apr 3, 2003
    Guys, please be wary of cross-site trolling. Criticizing the Escapist and their editorial content is fine but veer away from attacking their community or talking about troll accounts, that's against the rules

    *sighs* It used to be a high-brow site known for its strict editorial policies. But then they got starry-eyed about being a bigger site, lucked into drafting Yahtzee, and became a funny video hosting site with pathetic editorial policies leading to publishing articles and reviews that GameSpot would be ashamed of.

    Just goes to show the trade-off of popularity vs content.
  17. *Gasp!* People on the internet having different opinions on something popular?!? THIS MUST BE CORRECTED IMMEADIATELY!! TO THE ESCAPIST-MOBILE! *insert 60's batman song*
  18. Lexx

    Lexx Testament to the ghoul lifespan
    Moderator Modder

    Apr 24, 2005
    And it was super uncreative.

    At the Escapist article, FNV part: I find it horrible stupid, just as any other person in here. But by now this whole topic was talked about so often already that I wonder why it's still being talked about. It's like fighting windmills anyway.
  19. AWildmann

    AWildmann It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Sep 12, 2010
    Well, I can laugh a lot on his reviews, mostly because whatever he plays is kinda like whe have the same opinions. Most of the times I trust what he says due to that.

    Other than that, I gotta say I watched a lot of other videos there and haven't found a funny one.

    Still, I'm eager to see what else this kid (Blather) has in store for us.