Bethesda Shows Where Their Priorities Are (Patch 1.6 New)

Discussion in 'Fallout 4' started by Ragemage, Jul 8, 2016.

  1. Zyax

    Zyax Salt Powered Robot

    171
    Mar 14, 2016
    I mean, if you were being honest then you would know for fact that Fallout 4 couldn't be a lazy cash grab, simply based on the time and systems put into it. That aside, they tried to make it more appealing to a mass market, while still trying to keep the new fans established with 3 and NV. I never said they did that balance well, but regardless that's most likely what they went for.
     
  2. RoboStang

    RoboStang First time out of the vault

    69
    Jun 10, 2016
    "Systems?" You mean the shittiest video game engine currently on the market? I'd say using the same engine from 2002 is pretty fucking lazy. Yes, the creation engine is certainly upgraded, but it's still a polished turd. So, based on the time it took to make this game, refusing to create a new engine from scratch is very stingy.

    Seriously, engine is so bad that even a GTX 1080 can't hold above 60 FPS in city areas. Come the fuck on.

    Also, do you honestly think the three workshop DLC's aren't cash grabs that exist solely for the purpose of justifying the price of the season pass?
     
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  3. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    We would need some insight into their thinking and why they made certain decisions. Hard to say what they actually aimed for, hell we don't even know how long they actually worked on Fallout 4. Was it really 7 years? Well, if 7 years than they really have not much to show off ... but if they worked only a very short time on the game, than it begs the question what went wrong during production. I seriously doubt that everything was going according to their plan. The game simply feels to rushed for that. It offers the least content of any Beth game sofar, less than F3 and much less than Skyrim. It is also visualy the most I would say, bland game they made sofar. It's like everything took a step back from their previous games, when you use Morrowind as a start. With the exception of the graphics.
     
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  4. Black Angel

    Black Angel Grand Inquisitor of the Ordo Hereticus

    Mar 21, 2016
    Nah, on the contrary, if you were being honest then you would know for a fact that Fallout 4 is actually a lazy cash grab.
     
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  5. CerberusGate

    CerberusGate I should save my game in a whole new slot

    Jun 6, 2016
    7 years for the least amount of content in a Bethesda game? I'm all for giving the benefit of doubt but Fallout 4 does not have as much content even when compared to their previous games and so far, has only added onto the relatively empty game with relatively minute DLCs (Far Harbor may be a different story but it's essentially Point Lookout 2.0 so it's not much of a feat) and if you compare 4 to Fallout 3, FO3 has even more content that FO4. Even the new settlement mechanics feel like tacked on additions rather than actual mechanics due to the minute impact it actually has in the story. As for the shooting mechanics, I give credit to id Software who obviously knew what they were doing but Bethesda had to tack on their token RPG mechanics to turn opponents into bullet sponges and diminish the shooting mechanics implemented by id.
    So if I were being completely honest, I would say that Fallout 4 is lacking as a Bethesda game and is an actual lazy cash grab rather than a proper Bethesda game. Even with all the criticisms regarding Skyrim and Fallout 3, at least there was substantial content (not going to discuss quality though or else, a new thread will have to start).

    As @Crni Vuk points out, if Bethesda took 7 years only to produce what we got in base FO4, then Fallout 4 looks lazy in that regard. But if production was more recent, it paints a bad picture of their management and production process. After all, the final product we got for FO4 is a relatively simplistic shooting game with token RPG and settlement mechanics rather than the next step they could have taken by learning from the success and failings of New Vegas.
     
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  6. Deeves

    Deeves Well, he went a little funny in the head . . .

    96
    Jan 21, 2016
    I don't know, I wasn't in their offices, but this is what I can speculate knowing how the Xbox One was received by other Developers, especially from devs working on the launch title Ryse: Son of Rome;

    Two years were spent making an engine based on hypothetical, rough tech specs for the Xbox One and PS4. Then, around 2013 they actually got an Xbox One development kit, tore the hardware apart and went, 'Oh shit, Microsoft has completely lied to us, this box can't do anything we thought it could. It's too underpowered for any of our ambitious goals." and then they spent two more years scaling down their engine to fit consoles. That only gave them three years to actually produce the game, and on top of that they had to make it a 'true next gen experience' with 4k textures and models, which would take an exponential amount of man hours than their previous titles.

    Add to that a tyrannical dictator of a boss who's asking for console mod support before you can even get the game above 15 FPS on the thing and runs in with demands that Fallout needs Minecraft now because an interview with Notch just blew his mind, and refuses to add any more people to their current hundred employees? And a head writer who can't write for shit but can't be touched because of nepotism? Yeah, you're going to have a bad time.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2016
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  7. Black Angel

    Black Angel Grand Inquisitor of the Ordo Hereticus

    Mar 21, 2016
    That, and the way they 'deal' with their modding community, and from what I've heard they can't even hire a proper moderator for their own .net (as evidenced by the video below)

    it's obvious they want all the money for the lowest effort possible.
     
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  8. Deeves

    Deeves Well, he went a little funny in the head . . .

    96
    Jan 21, 2016
    I reject that argument simply because there are 1001 more ways to make higher yields of money with lower effort in the games industry. Hell, look at Ubisoft. And how many sequels they've pumped out while Todd was busy taking 7 years to make his epic. Sure, Fallout broke pre-order records, but I'm sure Assassin's Creed and it's nine titles that came out between 2011 and 2015 made at least more than double when the sales are aggregated.

    It really is just massive amounts of arrogance and noble-but-misguided incompetence that governs Bethesda Studios. I know you want them to be evil, but they're too pitiful to even be up there with EA or Ubi and the real threats to gaming.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2016
  9. CerberusGate

    CerberusGate I should save my game in a whole new slot

    Jun 6, 2016
    I think that's the worst part of all though regardless of whether Bethesda was incompetent or merely shills. If Bethesda was as cold, exploitative or even malicious as EA or Ubisoft, it would be easier to criticize their games or it would be more obvious to the general consumer that they should be criticized.

    However due to the good rep of Bethesda through their success via their older titles that the mainstream eats up, most of their problems would simply be shrugged off, not critiqued properly or not even brought to attention because "LOL Bethesda" which results in consumers simply accepting what they get even if pieces of the product are whittled away under less discerning eyes. At least there is a growing number of people becoming aware of Bethesda's incompetence though they tend to remain silent in contrast to the vocal minority that parrots typical Bethesdrone phrases and insults.
     
  10. Risewild

    Risewild Venerable Relic of the Wastes
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    While I don't think Bethesda is yet as bad as EA or Ubisoft the thing with Bethesda games not being as criticized and the general consumer is usually happy about the games it is all about one thing: MODS! *play trumpets*. "Mods will fix it" is usually heard by both people making fun of Bethesda games and people defending those same games. And it is true, try playing most Bethesda games without any mod at all and you will see how they do not stand very well on their own.
    Bethesda was always quite smart about allowing mods and "easy" mod making for their games, and it pays off.
    For example, one of the mods most downloaded for any Bethesda game is usually the Unofficial Patch(es) for that game.

    We can't really compare Bethesda with Ubisoft on any of both companies games. Why can't we?
    Because Bethesda had around 100 people working for them when Fallout 4 was released (November 2015) while Ubisoft had 10.000 people working for them by February 2016 (3 months difference. Source:"Ubisoft® FACTS & figures.pdf" ).
    So of course Ubisoft can pump Assassin Creed's and other games every few years. Bethesda would take many years to develop games, even if they are easy money grab games.
    Also we can't forget that just in the first 2 weeks Bethesda made 5 million dollars just from Fallout Shelter (definitely an easy money grab game. Source) and it is still making on average 15k dollars per day (Source 11 July 2016).
     
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  11. CerberusGate

    CerberusGate I should save my game in a whole new slot

    Jun 6, 2016
    Agreed. It's usually the first thing I download for each Bethesda game once a stable version is out.

    I gotta admit Bethesda was rather smart with releasing the The Elder Scrolls Construction Set alongside Morrowind so I guess their trends with relying on mods started there (though at least Morrowind had a solid base game that not too many mods were required). At least several good campaign and conversion mods were created using Bethesda's mod support but conversely it seems to have made them lazy.

    On a somewhat related note, seems there are issues with the Unofficial Fallout 4 patch, thanks to Bethesda:
    https://www.reddit.com/r/FalloutMod...sa_unofficial_fallout_4_patch_ufo4p_takes_an/
     
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  12. Deeves

    Deeves Well, he went a little funny in the head . . .

    96
    Jan 21, 2016
    Hey, by the way if any of you happen to be redditors, why not throw some Karma my way on that second highest post there? 88 points? Why not 100 I say! USA! USA! USA!
     
  13. R.Graves

    R.Graves Confirmed Retard

    Apr 21, 2016
    Nope. My name's still not up there. I guess I'm really not in their target audience.
     
  14. Black Angel

    Black Angel Grand Inquisitor of the Ordo Hereticus

    Mar 21, 2016
    Nah, they're all shady in my eyes, the same corporate motherfuckers in the same vein of the likes of Herve Caen, only now they somehow managed to succeed while Interplay crashed and burn, all those years ago since gaming was quite niche and the audience know the medium quite well. With the gaming world going mainstream, and a lot more people who's not exactly informed about video games, it's easier for these corporate shithead to exploit gaming industry to cash in so much money, in relatively short time and as little effort as possible.

    Bethesda might seem not as malicious as EA/Ubisoft/Activision, but that's only because Bethesda ain't as active as those three in the gaming industry. Bethesda's releasing progressively worsening shit once in a few years vs. EA/Ubisoft/Activision's releasing same shit every year? All shit, all shady. Besides, refer to Risewild's post as to why it's not exactly fair game to compare Bethesda to Ubisoft.
     
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  15. Einhanderc7

    Einhanderc7 Vat dipped, grown and still oozing with perfection

    858
    Apr 22, 2016
    *Throws up hands* "Screw it, its broke, get a new one." That's how I feel about this entire game's business model.
     
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  16. R.Graves

    R.Graves Confirmed Retard

    Apr 21, 2016
    I have this mental picture of bethesda when they finally realise Its hit the fan. A man in a polished suit just calmly pulls out a red folder labeled with something vaguely ominous. But more likely its a bunch dudes panicking flipping through rolodexes and screaming into phones and shit. Either way is cool.
     
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  17. 0wing

    0wing Все умрут, а я волномут

    Mar 23, 2015
    Dare to say it's the CPU hits 100% in Boston. Must be the lighting and shadows calculations sitting at one core, IDK.

    Come to think of, how does Creation Engine do rendering?
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2016
  18. Black Angel

    Black Angel Grand Inquisitor of the Ordo Hereticus

    Mar 21, 2016
    Next video game crash, when?

    (On the other hand, the current game's business model is 'too good' and 'too comforting' for the game developers these days. I mean, up until now the likes of EA, Ubisoft, Activision, and Bethesda still keep making easy money. Thankfully, we still had the likes of CDPR and indie guys who's still making games for rather niche but, for the lack of better words, loyal audience like NMA and the Codex.)
     
  19. Zyax

    Zyax Salt Powered Robot

    171
    Mar 14, 2016
    I would personally disagree, just based on some of what was added. The "evidence" for that is anecdotal at best, but I have a few friends who are indi devs that would love to have a crafting system like F4's, but say the coding is too difficult.
    Again, no.
    I make no arguments for the season pass or any of the DLCs. Also creating an engine, even one based on a previous engine, would most likely take years upon years, even if you were basing it off of a previous one. I know they get crap for it too, but in all honest Call of Duty developers are able to pull off some impressive work with their old engine. I'm not at all saying that they shouldn't upgrade, I feel they should, but I was referring to what was actually added to Fallout 4, mechanics wise.
     
  20. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
     
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