JE Sawyer on guns & gender

Discussion in 'NMA News and Information' started by Sam Ecorners, May 24, 2010.

  1. UncannyGarlic

    UncannyGarlic Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Feb 6, 2008
    Balance is more important than realism and grouping all firearms into the same skill isn't unreasonable, regardless of the specialized skills needed. I mean it's not like firing a rocket launcher, a minigun, and a flamer have a whole lot in common yet they all fit under Big Guns so making an all encompassing guns skill isn't much less reasonable. Having multiple skills is fine as long as they are equally viable, a problem which Fallout has had with many of the skills since the first game and I'd say that all of the weapons skills tended to be more useful than some of the others. It makes even more sense to roll them into a single skill if you make a lot of alternatives to combat and make it play a much smaller/more optional role.

    This whole discussion assumes that it won't be possible to max out every skill like in Fallout 3, which might be a vain hope.
  2. DemonNick

    DemonNick It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Feb 17, 2010
    Well he also said that their skill point "economy" is more frugal, which I think means that fewer skill points will be given out, or that you'll have to dump more in to get a large effect.
  3. Lexx

    Lexx Testament to the ghoul lifespan
    Moderator Modder

    Apr 24, 2005
    Maybe we will get 200% skills back + additional skill points are needed after x% of a skill reached. This way, they don't have to give out less xp per level (players psyche: WHAT?? WHY I JUS GET 5SP???) and everything else will still be able to balance out well.
  4. Grayswandir

    Grayswandir Mildly Dipped

    May 9, 2008
    Totally true.

    True for the rocket launcher and the flamer, otherwise I d say that the rest of the big gun fit really good together, so do the rest of the weapons in their respective categorie. So I wouldn't personly use two exceptions (maybe more?) to say that all weapon should be merged in one skill. That might be just me, but I always hate it in a movie when the hero can fly a alien saucer because he can fly an helicopter because he can ride a bycicle. My inner balance bleeds a lot.
    And I like having to wonder if i should spend my points on small gun to improve my actual survival chance, or starting to improve my big gun to prepare for the endgame and hope I find a minigun in the near future or learn to run quick. Anyway, I like differenciation in combat skill as well as in "civilian" one. I am also against mixing repair and science together, same with first aid and doctor.
  5. Ravager69

    Ravager69 Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Dec 21, 2007
    Alright, it seems I made a fool out of myself as well :) BTW your quoting skills suck :P

    Would you call it a gun instead? Makes as much sense as putting it into Energy Weapons.

    Also, did anyone notice that he said that strenght will affect how good you can aim and how fast you can attack with melee\unarmed? Pretty awesome, if you ask me.

    All in all, this changes DO make sense gameplay-wise and I'm all against keeping things the old way just for the sake of sentiment. If changes are for the better, then why not? As long as the game remains challenging, I say go for it.
  6. Ausir

    Ausir Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Apr 20, 2003
    The only Big Gun in Fallout 3 (which FNV bases on) that actually uses bullets is the minigun.
  7. Nark

    Nark Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Dec 6, 2008
    Bitches don't know about mah Sunbeam.

  8. Ausir

    Ausir Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Apr 20, 2003
    The Gatling Laser in FO1 and 2 was an energy weapon, not a big gun.
  9. Blackened

    Blackened I should set a cutom tite

    Jun 29, 2008
    An awesome way to limit energy weapon availability in early game is to set a skill requirement for each weapon.

    Anyway, having that big variety of weapons is unrealistic. In a real post-apoc world, you would have MUCH more small guns and most of the other weapons will be useless. Who would use a flamer when someone with a rifle can just shoot him and kill him? Who would use any melee or unarmed weapons at all? This applies for all Fallout games.

    But if it was as realistic, it would've been worse. I like the game as it is.
  10. Tagaziel

    Tagaziel Panzerkatze Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Dec 10, 2003
    That's bullshit. What's stopping you from taking a gun and pulling the trigger?
  11. Blackened

    Blackened I should set a cutom tite

    Jun 29, 2008
    Energy Weapons skill includes the conditioning of the guns. If it was just about taking the gun and pulling the trigger, then Firearms would've included Energy Weapons. Being good with flamers has nothing to do with firearms experience, but that don't have to do anything with shooting laser rifles, either. If one can understand the mechanism of a simple laser pistol, it would require more knowledge to use more complicated weapons.
  12. Lexx

    Lexx Testament to the ghoul lifespan
    Moderator Modder

    Apr 24, 2005
    Not beeing able to use a gun at all, due to too low skill, is very bad style.
  13. Burrich

    Burrich meme me up scotty

    Mar 2, 2010
    The way it worked in Morrowind and (I think) Oblivion, where you gain proficiency in skills by actually using them, rather than putting points into them when you level up is a much better way of doing things.
    GTA San Andreas had weapon proficiencies that increased with use for every specific type of weapon in the game, that's what I think should be used instead of the broken system which allows you to roam the wasteland mowing people down then when you level up you can put points into, for example, Lockpicking.
    Explain how you can become a master lockpicker without ever having picked a single lock in the entire game.
  14. Lexx

    Lexx Testament to the ghoul lifespan
    Moderator Modder

    Apr 24, 2005
    But it worked very bad in Morrowind and Oblivion and I doubt that it will ever work good in any game, because it makes you grind some action over and over again, if you want to higher a skill or stat.
  15. mobucks

    mobucks woof Orderite

    May 22, 2010
    Did repair and science really get rolled into one>?

    Fallout 4 will have one skill.

    Solve Quest.

    At the end of the day though its a FPS RPG so in combat... you take what you can get out of it. So long as it has better dialogue and quests im a happy gamer.
  16. flushfire

    flushfire First time out of the vault

    May 25, 2010
    Everyone seems to ignore (forget?) the existence of both FO2 and FO:Tactics. Big Guns wasn't trash in FO2 thanks mainly to the Bozar. It's even better in FO:T since you get access to the guns early. The excuse "it's not good to introduce lower tier big guns because it will further confuse..." isn't really acceptable. He means to say that weapon categories in FO:T was confusing because there's more Big Guns there? I've read lots of criticism about the game but that isn't one of them. I doubt anyone would say "hey why is this m249 in big guns it should've been in small guns" if they just introduced lower-end big guns. Also, categorizing the flamer as an energy weapon isn't confusing?

    However since they are using FO3 as basis then for balance I guess it's alright. I don't remember any high-end Small Guns in the game.
  17. Blackened

    Blackened I should set a cutom tite

    Jun 29, 2008
    Fallout Tactics isn't really considered a Fallout game by many gamers. Anyway, they haven't solved the Energy Weapons/Big Guns issue, there aren't low tier big guns or energy weapons there.

    In Fallout 3, the Terrible Shotgun and unique variants of Magnum Pistol were very powerful weapons. The balance in the game wasn't really good.
  18. flushfire

    flushfire First time out of the vault

    May 25, 2010
    just as FO:3 isn't really considered a Fallout game by fans of the first two? anyway that's beside the point. the point is in FO:T, Big Guns isn't a trash skill nor is it a late-game skill. mid-game you already have access to good big guns, most of which are better than the small guns or energy weapon available by that point.

    if in FO:T, "a game not considered by many gamers a Fallout game", Big Guns were made viable by introducing variants but not overpowered by being available too early (and also without further adding confusion to the categories) then why would adding more big guns not work to fill the gap? it just seems to me that by merging the two categories, they make more weapons available for less skill choice and investment. no more hard early game, easy late game (and vice versa), just easy game all throughout.
  19. whirlingdervish

    whirlingdervish Brahmin Cavalry Commander

    Jul 3, 2007
    What if they just raised your chance of critical failure by orders of magnitude when your character didn't meet the skill req?

    In that way, they could have a STR requirement to pick it up and use it, and a skill requirement to not hurt yourself with it.

    This would work well with melee weapons too.

    You might be strong enough to pick up a sword, but that doesn't mean you won't cut your own arm off with it unless you know how to use it..

    I didn't play FO3 so I'm not sure if they kept the critical failures tho..
  20. Wretched Flamingo

    Wretched Flamingo Sofa King

    Feb 14, 2010
    [youtube][/youtube] LOL