"Kill All Chechyens!"

Discussion in 'General Discussion Forum' started by APTYP, Sep 2, 2004.

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  1. The Commissar

    The Commissar Vault Senior Citizen
    Orderite

    May 18, 2004
    I know a few people in Beslan who've been telling me what they can, no one really knows what the fuck happened though. It seems the terrorists changed into nondescript clothes and made themselves out to look like all the other para military types milling around before the bombs went off and thats how so many were able to slip away.

    All those guys out of uniform were mostly retired miltary and people with kids in the schools who turned out to help.

    One of my friends actually was nearby and because of the lack of ambulances volunteered his car to carry wounded.

    If/When I get some facts and details I'll post them but no one has really been able to give me anything solid yet
     
  2. John Uskglass

    John Uskglass Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Aug 29, 2003
    ===================================================
    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5912071/


    Self-criticism in Arab media follows school siege

    Al-Arabiya GM: Muslims are main perpetrators of terrorismThe Associated Press
    Updated: 6:32 a.m. ET Sept. 4, 2004CAIRO, Egypt - Muslims worldwide are the main perpetrators of terrorism, a humiliating and painful truth that must be acknowledged, a prominent Arab writer and television executive wrote Saturday, as Middle East media and officials expressed horror at the bloody rebel siege of a Russian school.

    Unusually forthright self-criticism followed the end of the hostage crisis, along with warnings that such actions inflict more damage to the image of Islam than all its enemies could hope. Arab leaders and Muslim clerics denounced the school seizure as unjustifiable and expressed their sympathy.

    Russian commandos stormed the school Friday in Beslan, Russia; it had been taken over by rebels demanding independence for Chechnya. Russian officials said Saturday that the death toll was at least 250, with twice as many wounded. Many of the casualties were children.

    Images of terrified young survivors being carried from the scene aired repeatedly on Arab TV stations. Pictures of dead and wounded children ran on front pages of Arab newspapers Saturday.

    “Holy warriors” from the Middle East long have supported fellow Muslims fighting in Chechnya, and Russian officials said nine or 10 Arabs were among militants killed.

    “Our terrorist sons are an end-product of our corrupted culture,” Abdulrahman al-Rashed, general manager of Al-Arabiya television wrote in his daily column published in the pan-Arab Asharq Al-Awsat newspaper. It ran under the headline, “The Painful Truth: All the World Terrorists are Muslims!”

    'Humiliating, painful' picture
    Al-Rashed ran through a list of recent attacks by Islamic extremist groups — in Russia, Iraq, Sudan, Saudi Arabia and Yemen — many of which are influenced by the ideology of Osama Bin Laden, the Saudi-born leader of the al-Qaida terror network.

    “Most perpetrators of suicide operations in buses, schools and residential buildings around the world for the past 10 years have been Muslims,” he wrote. Muslims will be unable to cleanse their image unless “we admit the scandalous facts,” rather than offer condemnations or justifications.

    “The picture is humiliating, painful and harsh for all of us,” al-Rashed wrote.

    Contributors to Islamic Web sites known for their extremist content had mixed reactions on the hostage crisis, with some praising the separatists. Others wrote that people should wait until the militants had been identified before implicating Arabs in the drama.

    Ahmed Bahgat, an Egyptian Islamist, wrote in his column in Egypt’s leading pro-government newspaper, Al-Ahram, that hostage-takers in Russia as well as in Iraq are only harming Islam.

    “If all the enemies of Islam united together and decided to harm it ... they wouldn’t have ruined and harmed its image as much as the sons of Islam have done by their stupidity, miscalculations, and misunderstanding of the nature of this age,” Bahgat wrote.

    'A new low'
    The horrifying images of the dead and wounded Russian students “showed Muslims as monsters who are fed by the blood of children and the pain of their families.”

    An editorial in the Saudi English-language Arab News put some blame for the bloody end to the school siege on Russian President Vladimir Putin, saying he couldn’t afford to lose his “tough-man image.” But it added that “the Chechens, with the choice of their targets, had put themselves in a position where no one would shed tears when the punishment came. They reached a new low when they chose toddlers as bargaining chips.”

    Heads of state from Egypt, Lebanon and Kuwait offered their sympathy Friday to Russian officials and to the families of people caught up in the hostage drama. A prominent Muslim cleric also denounced it.

    “What is the guilt of those children? Why should they be responsible for your conflict with the government?” Egypt’s top Muslim cleric, Grand Sheik Mohammed Sayed Tantawi, was quoted as saying during a Friday sermon in Banha, 30 miles north of Cairo.

    “You are taking Islam as a cover and it is a deceptive cover; those who carry out the kidnappings are criminals, not Muslims,” Tantawi, who heads Al-Azhar University, the highest authority in the Sunni Islamic world, was quoted by Egypt’s Middle East News agency as saying.

    © 2004 The Associated Press.


    http://forums.gawaher.com/index.php?showtopic=21279&

    :puke:
     
  3. Wooz

    Wooz Vault Sweeper Admin Orderite

    May 18, 2003
    Nice article.

    Chechen extremists have placed themselves and all their people in a bloody stupid position. After this incident, I doubt there will be much sympathy for their cause when the Russians mow them down again.
     
  4. John Uskglass

    John Uskglass Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Aug 29, 2003
    Rightfully too. The age of Prisoner of the Cauceses is over, and no one cares. I almost hope Putin goes over board.
     
  5. Wooz

    Wooz Vault Sweeper Admin Orderite

    May 18, 2003
    "Rightfully"?

    I think it's unfair that all the Chechen population will have to pay for the excesses of that militant separatist group.
     
  6. John Uskglass

    John Uskglass Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Aug 29, 2003
    There's a point there. And many of the terrorists where Arabs and Turks. But I'm in too much of a funk to care about anything but helping the Russians get revenge. I have'nt fealt this way sense 9/11, this is the worst act imagineable.
     
  7. The Commissar

    The Commissar Vault Senior Citizen
    Orderite

    May 18, 2004
    You can't hold all of Chechnya responsible. They live in a literal wasteland without water, electricity or hope. However, the fact that Russia continues to try and control their government, continues to terrorize the population, continues to expend massive amounts of money and manpower to crush any dissidents is NOT I repeat NOT an excuse for a cowardly attack on a school. It is wrong and unjustifiable. Sadly in the minds of those rebels they are left little choice in the matter, becuase Russia is a beast they could never hope to defeat.
    And they can't!
    Do most Russians give a rats ass about Chechnya? NO! Its just a giant infected sore that grows worse every day. They continue to treat it by scratching at it viciously instead of just leaving a bandage on it.
    CCR was right before, it WAS getting better. Russia messing with the elections and no one caring sent a big message to the Chechnyan extremists.

    Of course there will be a reprisal for this henious act, but its not going to help anyone to blow up some more collapsed buildings and cut power to hospitals in Chechnya, and thats all they can really do.


    Edited for Clarity
     
  8. Wooz

    Wooz Vault Sweeper Admin Orderite

    May 18, 2003
    If the Russian comeback is violent, it's going to help the crackpot mullahs for their cannon-fodder recruitment speeches, for sure.

    Ever thought that something along the lines of "I'm too much of a funk to care about anything but getting revenge" is probably the exact thing terrorists think while planning and executing their attacks?
     
  9. APTYP

    APTYP Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Apr 2, 2003
    Yes you can.

    Poor drug-dealing, people-kidnapping, plane-crashing, child-murdering, Russian-POW-head-cutting, civilian-bombing bastards!

    Now I know why only one western newspaper somewhere in Dallas did not hesitate to call them "terrorists" instead of a more politically correct "militant" or "armed gang". In your mind, Chechyen head-cutter, drug dealer, and child-killer is a better person than a Russian soldier and a Russian civilian.

    Has something to do with your childhood friend having his head cut off for Al-Jazeera while Americans nod in approval - "serves you right, commie aggressor! i hope you die painfully for all your transgressions you red swine!". Or maybe standing in a morgue next to torn body parts of your child killed by a freedom-fighting Chechyen's bomb.

    Of course the situation would reverse 180 if you were talking about war in Iraq.
     
  10. Wooz

    Wooz Vault Sweeper Admin Orderite

    May 18, 2003
    Hey everybody! It's target practice!
     
  11. The Commissar

    The Commissar Vault Senior Citizen
    Orderite

    May 18, 2004
    Whew, I almost took him seriously for a second. Thanks for pulling me back from the brink Comrade Wooz
     
  12. APTYP

    APTYP Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Apr 2, 2003
    I'm dead-serious, shitheads.
     
  13. APTYP

    APTYP Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Apr 2, 2003
    While you're being dead serious, you should ponder every possible meaning of the phrase "Silent as the grave"
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    You didn't like what I said? Struck a nerve, maybe? What's that dull sting in your heart - maybe your conscience? Why are you telling me to shut up - are you embarrased for yourself?
     
  15. Flop

    Flop Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?

    474
    Aug 10, 2004
    In that case I think I'll just stop reading this thread...
     
  16. The Commissar

    The Commissar Vault Senior Citizen
    Orderite

    May 18, 2004
    What the fuck are you talking about? Half of my family lives in Russia most right on the border with Chechnya with 2 good friends living IN Beslan! One of them drove two boys who had been shot in the back to a hospital becuase there were no more ambulances. This hits home for me, literally.

    Did you actually read anything I said? I said it was unjustifiable. I did say it was part of a continued cycle of violence that the rebels feel is the only way to be heard. Did I say it was right? No! Did I say it would work? No!

    You think Russia is just going to target a few isolated Rebel camps in the mountains? What world are you living in? They are going to go in and make all of Chechnya pay like they always do, and the cycle starts over again.
     
  17. APTYP

    APTYP Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Apr 2, 2003
    It hit you nowhere:

    You are useless. Even more so because you are defending the perpetrators by shifting the blame from Chechyen killers to Russian protectors.

    No, I hope Putin would finally listen to what everyone was saying since the 90's - gas and nuke Chechnya until there is not a living soul left. And I'm sure Osetians think just the same now.

    They were given a chance to be good boys. They were given a chance through negotiation and concessions. They were tolerated. The outcome? Oh, just 200 dead children, no biggie, it's all Russia's fault anyway, poor Chechyens, I hope it works out for them boo hoo.
     
  18. The Commissar

    The Commissar Vault Senior Citizen
    Orderite

    May 18, 2004
    You got me, I'm actually in favor of killing every last Russian man, woman and child so that Chechnya may be free at last.

    You saw right through my thinly veiled disguise of reason and logic... curses!
     
  19. Wooz

    Wooz Vault Sweeper Admin Orderite

    May 18, 2003
    And you're an arrogant moron.
    You have no idea about the subject, you probaby haven't bothered to read the whole debate. Do you have any kind of idea about what's been happening over there besides the bullshit you watched on Fox News? "Russian Protectors, Chechen Killers". Yes, undoubtedly, the world is black and white.
    Correction, you're a propaganda-fed redneck imbecile. Or a redneck imbecile's kid. Or both.

    Congratulations, It has been a very, very long while since someone posted such a blatantly stupid thing on a political thread. I reccomend you to leave your dad's computer alone and go back to play with your Action Man figure.
     
  20. APTYP

    APTYP Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Apr 2, 2003
    Hey, I bought this computer by working hard - I had to fight sleep all day! And my neck isn't red anymore, it's toasty-patchy brown, god I hope summer ends soon.
     
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