Legion/BoS war (Expect spoilers)

Discussion in 'Fallout: New Vegas Discussion' started by Faceless Stranger, Nov 16, 2010.

  1. Threepwood

    Threepwood Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    Nov 4, 2010
    On health: Thousands of men sleeping in a very compact space, with rotting crucified bodies punctuating thier living space, as well as a complete lack of effective medical care, and a small ammount of women, who are, presumably raped leading to mass transmission of diseases. Well, the Legion would destroy itself in about a year when everyone dies from the cold in crappy tents, while the BOS are chillin' in the bunker.
  2. The Dutch Ghost

    The Dutch Ghost Grouchy old man of NMA Moderator

    Jan 11, 2004
    Heh Tagaziel is completely enamored by the Legion :D
  3. Relentless666

    Relentless666 It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Dec 23, 2008
    I'd say the Legion would avoid direct combat with the BoS. It's more likely they'd resort to guerrilla warfare. Also, even though the Legion doesn't have guns, they sure don't have a problem with using mines. And even Power Armor's not immune to some well-placed explosives.
  4. Faceless Stranger

    Faceless Stranger Board Drifter

    Aug 19, 2010
    Lest I remind everyone:

    "Made of a poly-laminate composite, the outer shell of the T-51b is lightweight and capable of absorbing over 25,000 Joules of kinetic impact. The 10-micron-thick silver ablative coating can reflect laser and other radiation emissions without damage to the composite subsurface."

    I don't think the Legion's pussy frag-mines will pose much of a threat realistically. And the Brotherhood doesn't really rely on supply lines like the NCR does, being more isolationist, so guerrilla warfare wouldn't be that effective. They have radar capabilities, so they'll have superior tactics at hand as well. There are also many paladins in the Hidden Valley bunker...

    "...it has the power to destroy entire towns without endangering the wearer from attacks by conventional firearms or even missile launchers..."

    And that's on the T-45d, the less-advanced precursor to the T-51b...
  5. Threepwood

    Threepwood Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    Nov 4, 2010
    Hell it's said when the Legion fought the remnants, they lost hundreds upon hundreds of men, before finnally giving up, and this is against what, four old dudes and an autistic pilot?

    The BOS would shred the Legion no question imo.
  6. Faceless Stranger

    Faceless Stranger Board Drifter

    Aug 19, 2010
    The Legion was built to lose, they just can't stand against anyone using tech more advanced than the NCR's. Put'em up against Power Armor, and that's it....
  7. Relentless666

    Relentless666 It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Dec 23, 2008
    Man, these last two games make me forget how awesome the Power Armor is supposed to be.
  8. Faceless Stranger

    Faceless Stranger Board Drifter

    Aug 19, 2010
    Yup... it makes me sad really....
  9. KillerBee256

    KillerBee256 Still Mildly Glowing

    Oct 31, 2008
    They're are ways they could take someone in power armor down, using c4 to create a rock slide might work. I think both sides would resort to gurria warfare. Who to say some more intellgent person might rise to power and reorganize the leagion after getting there arses kicked when ever they fought out in the open. Thought I have to wonder how much tech is just laying around unused in leagion land, hell prewar millitary bases alone.
  10. OakTable

    OakTable Vault Senior Citizen

    Nov 26, 2009
    I think it's the copious amounts of mansex that goes on there that won him over.

    Jokes aside, the Legion does have some hard hitting weapons. Power Fists, Super Sledges, 12.7mm Pistols and SMGs (12.7mm is basically a slightly weaker .50 BMG), and nothing says they wouldn't take the NCR weapons, like the .308 sniper rifles and what not.
  11. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all

    Apr 3, 2003
    The ballistic fist is probably their most effective anti-power armor weapon. That said, while it might work in Fallout 3/New Vegas game-balance wise, lorewise fights between a paladin and a bunch of legionaries would not likely end in seconds with the legionaries punchraping the paladin.
  12. Faceless Stranger

    Faceless Stranger Board Drifter

    Aug 19, 2010
    Well, I meant the thread as being lorewise, seeing as how Power Armor has been nerfed to shit from the first 2 games... I remember only being able to be killed with a crit from a minigun or gatling laser in my hardened PA from FO.
  13. vanzizzle

    vanzizzle It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Feb 15, 2010
    What about pulse? Or plasma explosives?
  14. Faceless Stranger

    Faceless Stranger Board Drifter

    Aug 19, 2010
    Legion doesn't use energy weapons.
  15. Tagaziel

    Tagaziel Panzerkatze Orderite

    Dec 10, 2003
    The legionaries aren't average men nor are they woman raping savages. Humanity has survived worse evironments and managed to thrive.

    Besides, cots and blankets aren't exactly impossible to make. Actually, they're quite simple to make and are used by the Legion.

    This entire argument hinges on the assumption that having a technological advantage equals victory. History has proved time and time again that this is not the case.

    The Brotherhood is a high tech organization armed with powered infantry armour, rotary cannons both conventional and laser, high powered gauss rifles and other high tech weaponry. They also have reinforced bunkers and advanced medical services at their disposal.

    However, their numbers are limited. They don't have radar devices (you can only allow them to tap into what remains of the Black Mountain array), have to rely on lone scouts to gain intelligence, have very few agents in the area and have no spies whatsoever in the Legion.

    Furthermore, the T-51b and T-45d can be countered. They are great weapons of war, sure, and deadly in a head-on engagement, but they too have their limits that can be easily exploited by a properly trained enemy. Most importantly, the operator is a soft, squishy human, so to disable a suit, you need simply to get the meat inside the can and there are plenty of ways, from simply torching the armour with home-made napalm or knocking it into a crevice with a cleverly laid mine and a rockslide to more subtle methods, such as dumping paint on the helmet (to obscure vision, the eyepiece can't be easily cleaned in the field) and when the owner removes it to clean it, use poisoned weapons to kill him (that's how Rhombus II died).

    On to guerilla warfare. Guerilla warfare isn't just attacking supply lines. It's harassing weapon stockpiles, drawing enemies into traps and killing zones, destroying their bases. With the Brotherhood, the solution is simple and elegant - collapse the entrance to their bunker. The Legion has many scouts and many eyes west of the Colorado and it is not far fetched to assume that if open conflict would take place, the Brotherhood's base would be found very fast. After all, it's not hard to figure out where your opponent's hiding if he's sending giant tin men after you that stand out like a sore thumb in the desert. The Brotherhood is putting all it's eggs in one basket and all it takes to ruin that basket is a little skill in sneaking and a backpack of semtex.

    Not to mention traps. The Legion's defeat at Boulder City was a costly lesson and surely an inspiring one. A power armour isn't going to do you much good if explosives suddenly tear your legs off or you're crushed under several tons of rock in a canyon you entered in pursuit of a Legion war party. Or landing in a deep pit you can't climb out of. Or (as mentioned above) being thrown off a cliff and falling couple of tens of meters down and breaking your neck.

    The possibilities are limitless. The Remnants were able to survive in the Legion ending thanks to the fact that they were constantly mobile and defending themselves, rather than attacking. The Brotherhood, on the other hand, in their war against the Legion would have to rely on stationary bases and camps and aggressive tactics which, as I illustrated above, would not work in their favour.

    The Legion is built to win. If the Republic, whose army that DEFEATED the Brotherhood of Steel, is facing defeat against the Legion in 2281 without the Courier's intervention, that alone speaks volume of their ability to defeat the Brotherhood.
  16. Ausir

    Ausir Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Apr 20, 2003
    Tell that to Lanius. Who was the person designated by Caesar as his successor, of all others.

    Actually, it's Maxson II.
  17. Tagaziel

    Tagaziel Panzerkatze Orderite

    Dec 10, 2003
    You're a horrible person, Ausir.
  18. Nalano

    Nalano Still Mildly Glowing

    Jan 20, 2009
    While technical advantage alone doesn't necessarily win wars, I'd still much rather be on the side with the machine guns.

    After all, if men are no object, you can always make your opponent pay more than they're willing to. But I wouldn't want to fight in that army.

    After all, the Chechens and Afghanis didn't beat the Russians in Russia; they just stopped the Russians from beating them without putting in the effort.
  19. Ausir

    Ausir Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Apr 20, 2003
    Sorry, couldn't resist.
  20. Texas Renegade

    Texas Renegade Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    Aug 21, 2008
    well the ncr had power armor troops at the dam and it didn't help them too much.

    At a point, sheer numbers would overwhelm the bos I am afraid.