Who else REALLY hated Amata?

Discussion in 'Fallout 3 Discussion' started by Tarantulakelurk, May 2, 2014.

  1. Atomic Postman

    Atomic Postman Vault Archives Overseer

    Mar 16, 2013
    An absolutely forced Love-Interest in a game where freedom for character creation and personality should be paramount, she is one of the symptoms of the plague that Fallout 3 is/suffers from.

    Hated the concept of her as a character.
     
  2. zegh8578

    zegh8578 Keeper of the trout Orderite

    Mar 11, 2012
    Both forced and failed, from the beginning, I had no clue what the hell her purpose was, other than to confuse the player "Hi I'm probably some kind of romance" "Now I'm being a hard-ass refusing to join you" "Now I want you back, if you care, you should remember the password! Sniff!" "Okay, hardass-me, here I come again!"

    Just like marathon-dad, another "please-love-me"-character, that completely fails in gaining the players emotional investment.

    Hell, from the first few seconds I talked to Chief Hanlon in Fallout NV I genuinely felt more for him, than I felt for "dad" in several FO3 playthroughs.
     
  3. BigBoss

    BigBoss Your Local Scrub

    956
    Dec 24, 2012
    My favorite part is how his dad manages to walk the wastes, go through the DC sewers, move through the DC ruins, hit Galaxy News Radio, move back through sewers and ruins to Rivet City, go back to the Washington Monument filled with Muties, and then take a huge trip across the wastes to the Vault he was looking for, and does this ALL BY HIMSELF.

    HOWEVER, when you arrive at the Washington Monument with more than enough people with you to take down the Super Mutants inside, he sends you in alone due to his lack of combat experience. WTF? You were able to comb your way solo through the sewers and ruins of DC, and then walk halfway across the Wasteland all by yourself, but now you can't even have my back in a fight with Mutants which you undoubtedly came across a couple times in your journey through DC? Wow...

    Even the Lonesome Wandered needed help getting through the DC ruins (which he got from the BOS patrol), but Dad was able to do it alone. Yet, he sends his only son, nay, only CHILD in there ALONE to clear out a nest full of Super Mutants.

    Either this dude was able to sneak his way through DC and the Wasteland without alerting anyone or anything, OR he would rather have his son risk his life clearing out the Super Mutants before he's forced to do it, which he's probably perfectly capable of.
     
  4. naossano

    naossano So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Oct 19, 2006
    All of this possibly the same day as his son. (even if that son could be a girl)
    He left the same day as you did and you can rush toward him, ignoring other quests, since the world scale to your level.
     
  5. BigBoss

    BigBoss Your Local Scrub

    956
    Dec 24, 2012
    That wasn't one of my problems.

    In the first Fallout you can run straight to Necropolis and get the water chip.
     
  6. naossano

    naossano So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Oct 19, 2006
    Nice, but is has zero relationship with what i said.

    The guy was probably there the same day as you, and yet, there are many super-mutants all over the place. (and all the thing you said on the previous post)
     
  7. TheChosen1

    TheChosen1 Moving Target

    Nov 8, 2012
    I think that that is because he is set to essential but he wants to hide his true identity of being a plot device by acting helpless or nonchalant after being detonated by the most illogical weapon.

    EDIT: He also spawned all the SM's or the SM's just invaded the place right after Daddy-Dear ran away (even though he managed to gather enough information in less than a day after being chased away by the super mutants (which managed to drag their gore bags in already))

    It makes as much sense as there being a full on uprising just DAYS after you leave (even though everyone says it's been months)
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2014
  8. Knight Captain Kerr

    Knight Captain Kerr Still Mildly Glowing

    208
    Nov 27, 2011
    I liked Amata, her being upset at her father's death is understandable and she's certainly not a copy of him. However I felt her kicking you out of the Vault was kind of forced and that it happened more because of the writers wanting to make parallels to Fallout 1 rather than developing naturally from the characters. Her father kicking you out if you help him makes sense, Amata not so much.
     
  9. naossano

    naossano So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Oct 19, 2006
    Maybe he just happened to be inside, the only day of the months the SM aren't there, being busy bringing children near the entrance of Little Lamplight, to replenish the settlement population or the day they bring load of money to Tempeny tower.
     
  10. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    She didn't have enough character for me to hate her. I was actually surprised whe nI found out that people actually felt anything other than indifference towards her and even made her their waifus.... guess it doesn't take much for that last one, huh.
     
  11. SnapSlav

    SnapSlav NMA's local DotA fanatic

    Jul 1, 2012
    I was surprised people actually assumed Amata was the "default love interest". I mean, she CLEARLY wasn't, that goes to Sarah Lyons. Lyons goes through the steps of the evolving relationship with the character as the player progresses through the game that Amata never does. From the gruff and emotionally cold state of rejection, to the reluctant yet warmly surprised welcome, to the loyal companion who has your back, to the tragic loved one who fell because of you, to the joyous reunion right before the climatic ending, to the sentimental realization that had your paths perhaps crossed at different times you might have been something else to one another, it's all Lyons. This is OBVIOUSLY the de facto romantic character, not Amata. Hell, REILLY has more going for her as a potential romantic interest than Amata ever could. XD

    Amata is the childhood friend. The lifelong bond. The special person who's like a sibling to the player character. That's all she was ever meant to be, and her lines of disgust when the player can choose to say that they were dreaming about her reflect this sort of relationship. She was never meant to be romantically tied to the Lone Wanderer, and it boggles my mind that so many players don't see this. That said, like I said before (and as the above post reiterated), she didn't have ENOUGH character development to represent much of anything, really.
     
  12. BigBoss

    BigBoss Your Local Scrub

    956
    Dec 24, 2012
    Well, with Bethesda you can never be too sure.

    But yeah, Amata does at first come off as a love interest, but later in the game it is made more apparent that she's more of the "best friend, your still in the friend zone" kinda shit.

    I never viewed Sarah Lyons as any kind of love interest though. Especially since she pretty much dies (or falls into a seemingly un-fixable coma), which was kind of like fucked up sense of humor on Bethesda's part. "Here's your best friend. Love interest? Nope, Friend Zone mother fucker. Here' Sarah Lyons. Love interest. Yep. For awhile anyway, until she dies/gets put into an unrevivable coma before she can become anything close to an ACTUAL love interest."
     
  13. SnapSlav

    SnapSlav NMA's local DotA fanatic

    Jul 1, 2012
    Exactly the opposite of that, in fact. When the storytelling is deep and layered, you can never be too sure. But when it's stale, predictable, childish, and simple, it's very, VERY easy to be sure.

    I really never saw what the "Amata romantice character" supporters fantasized, because she was NEVER depicted as more than a friend in the game. Not later in the game, not earlier in the game. Never. When you have the option to comment upon being woken up by Amata shortly before fleeing the vault that you had been dreaming about her, she's disgusted by the notion and asserts that now's not the time for jokes. There are no other alternatives in her response. There's no circumstance on the lone Wanderer's upbringing decisions that may lead to her being receptive towards the character in any fashion other than friendship. The closest she ever comes to being romance material is the role played one-sided affection that's totally anchored in the player's silly mind, not found anywhere in the game.

    But as for Lyons, she's hardly out of commission for very long, unless you take your sweet-ass time doing fuck all at the opening of "Broken Steel" before completing it. Regardless, it's like I said, that period is her character undergoing the "tragic loved one" arc of her character's evolution. You have that touching moment when one must be sacrificed, and when you come out of your coma she's unconscious too, and it looks depressing and bleak. Then once your mission to save the day reaches its climatic conclusion, lo and behold Sarah Fucking Lyons shows up, right as rain, to take you back to safety, and in the epilogue she reveals totally candidly that she feels very strongly for the Lone Wanderer, and wistfully wishes that their circumstances had been a little different. Barring a Bioware-esque romance subplot, that's the closest a game like this ever WILL get to 2 characters falling in love. This is all, of course, contingent on the player not making the most bastard-evil of choices, mind you. No "fuck that, I'm not going in there, you go sacrifice yourself" or targeting the Citadel instead of the walker, etc. It's still a definitely love interest, albeit a simple and fairly one-dimensional one. Again, with Bethesda, you really CAN be too sure.
     
  14. TheChosen1

    TheChosen1 Moving Target

    Nov 8, 2012
    What is wrong with Moira? I mean I know she is mentally unstable, but I enjoyed her character and personality, even if the voice got a bit annoying (although it suited her).
    As for Amata I hated her about as much as I hated the rest of the NPCs.
     
  15. SnapSlav

    SnapSlav NMA's local DotA fanatic

    Jul 1, 2012
    Really? Are you seriously asking that?

    Her voice is one thing, but that's alleviated from the fact that (though she sounds VERY similar to the rest of the female cast) she's a unique voice. And thank God for that, considering how MUCH of Moira you have to suffer through when undertaking her tasks. That said, it's not Moira's voice that's so detestable, it's her CHARACTER. This is supposed to be Fallout, the post-apocalyptic nuclear wasteland in an alternate retrofuture where things are so grim, unless you were lucky enough to be born into a large enough town, your life was always in danger of slavery, raiders, disease, and all sorts of lethal mishaps, where getting by was a goal to look forward to each day. But Moira's a childlike character without a care in the world.... the world of Fallout. Her tasks are equally retarded, as she requests that the Lone Wanderer soak themself in radiation just to explain how it feels, then walk into a minefield deliberately so she can figure out how to explain the dangers of landmines, then scavenge from a super market that was obviously going to have been picked dry or taken over by unfriendlies. Her only tasks with a semblance of sense to them was testing out her anti-molerat concoction, uncovering the history behind Rivet City, and things of that nature; ACTUAL investigation. But those made up tiny parcels of Moira's overall tasks, and her character reinforced the childishness of these endeavors every step of the way.

    She would have been violently out of place had Bethesda not suitably fucked up the rest of the setting around her, but even still, she feels noticeably off. That's quite telling of her character, though, that despite the setting around having been dumbed down so severely that she STILL stands out as an irritable nuisance.
     
  16. Timbus95

    Timbus95 Banned

    43
    May 25, 2014
    She actually wanted the Lone Wanderer to get irradiated so she could test a new remedy for irradiation sickness she made, which would require getting irradiated. The optional objective of getting 600 rads were probably so that even the most irradiated of people could easily seek treatment. For the landmines, she actually wanted you to go to minefield and get a landmine to see how somebody can disarm one, pretty useful in the wasteland as according to her they are worth alot. As for Super Duper Mart, she probably didn't know for sure, it probably would make more sense with better writing.

    I don't really see how those parts are tiny parcels, they require as much work as the first three parts of the quest and she has good reasons for finding out the information (she wanted to see how Rivet City came to be so other wastelanders could take pointers on how to build a settlement, figuring out how to reprogram and control robots, very helpful if you need to defend a settlement, etc).

    I'm pretty sure the game hints at her not being "right in the head" so to say. She even takes sarcastic responses at face value (I think this is intentional of her character and not the result of crappy writing actually). Even the Lone Wanderer can call her out sometimes on her disregard, but at least she fixes you up after the crippling injuries and radiation sickness so shes not entirely insane. I just take it that she's a "stepford smiler" as the game somewhat hints at it, but that may just be me.
     
  17. naossano

    naossano So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Oct 19, 2006
    Indeed, she was intended as irresponsible, and no aware of the danger her missions involve.
    They don't need the LW to get irradiated (with could be lethal or might not be healed) when there are many irradiated people, she does't need to cripple or hurt the LW, while there is a doctore in town that see injuries every day.
    Of course, the dev give many clues about her not being right in her head, by her answers and her computer notes. Of course, you can take the dream crusher.
    But in the other hand the game aknowledges her too much than it should.
    Walking on the minefield, for instance, shouldn't even be a quest. Do you imagine your character actually doing that, risking his own life, just to appeal a complete maniac ?
    Also, there is the problem of the survival guide. Amongs all the people that are outside a vault, by the end of Fo3, Moira Brown & the Lone Wanderer, are the two worst people in the whole East-USA to write that kind of book. Moira isn't aware of the very basic things, the Lone wanderer lived in a vault all his life and is dumb enough to follow her instructions. Let's say you ignore it in Fo3. Here comes the survival guide in FoNV, that is probably unrelated, as these guys has the survival in their blood. Yet, without any confirmation of being a different book, many Fo3 fanboy think that Moira wrote a book that spread toward the Mojave, that Moira crazyness was spread into the core region, the region untouched by B. And Ob. cannot even deny it, as they can't make any statement.
     
  18. Atomkilla

    Atomkilla Hazel Hegemon oTO Orderite

    Dec 26, 2010

    As much as I'd like to agree with you and take your post as a logical approach to this problem, I'd say that FNV's Survival Guide is an obvious reference to the one from FO3, if not the same one. FNV/Obsidian had to acknowledge FO3's existence in some way, I guess, so they took the easiest road, of giving tiny bits of info and nods here and there - the guide being one, one particular piece of information ED-E gives being second etc.

    It may sound bad, having an idiotic book written in some hellhole near DC traverse the whole continent and spread its vile influence over the Core region and further, but if that's pretty much the maximum mention of FO3 in FNV, then I'm satisfied.
     
  19. naossano

    naossano So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Oct 19, 2006
    The most likely is that, considering FoNV uses many Fo3 assets, they use an already existing item and repurpose it as a skill book.
    It would make no sense to have Moira's book in-universe. Not only Moira & the Lone Wanderer aren't fitted to write that kind of book, but the Mojave/Core region don't need a new book on that matter. There already have many more usefull book and they know very well how to survive the wasteland wildlife. They are born to survive in it, not mentioning the Follower of Apocalypse being well spread here, and other groups like the mormons. It would have made more sense a few decades before Fo1, while most survivors just left their vaults/caves/shelters, but not by the time of FoNV in everything that sounds wastelandish for us, is the normal stuff, and slowly becomes the past.
     
  20. Timbus95

    Timbus95 Banned

    43
    May 25, 2014
    Just because the Core region doesn't need it doesn't mean the rest of America can't use it. We haven't seen much outside the Core region yet so it very well could be useful outside the Core region. Besides, just because people are born into the wasteland doesn't mean they know everything and anything to survive in the wasteland, a survival guide could come in handy.