Is NV too much NCR-Sided?

Discussion in 'Fallout: New Vegas Discussion' started by gongos, Nov 25, 2010.

  1. Lone Cat

    Lone Cat It Wandered In From the Wastes

    147
    Apr 8, 2012
    New Reno as seen in F2, One city divided by four warring warlords, is what will organized crime becomes after the fall of Law and Order (along with nation states on earth, including the once-mighty the United States), they became the Law and Order by their very own standards. simply creates yet-another medieval feudalism. yet only two 'gangs' cited with superior 'nations'; One gang signed a deal with the Enclave, others joined NCR.. also by then, boths are at war (not sure? but by then Enclave saw NCR as an organized cessesionist movement, NCR saw Enclave as 'evil fascists')

    I think in New Reno, TWO gangs were a descendants of classic Mafia... similar organization the Omertas in FNV is.
     
  2. Languorous_Maiar

    Languorous_Maiar A Smooth-Skin

    688
    Oct 25, 2011
    I know all of it.
    I'm just using his logic... to prove it is completely meaningless.
    If you are discussing with someone, who are objecting all proofs (dialogues, developers words) just "because" (without giving anything from himself) etc. you can't do otherwise, than using his annoying style of writing.
     
  3. laclongquan

    laclongquan Boned Hunter of Sister

    561
    Jan 11, 2008
    Oi oi, if some SM totally lose sense of self preservation so as to want to be consumed I will not hesitate to brand "mindless drone" damn quick. The fact that at least one has the sense god bestow on animals is supporting your position of SM being smart right now. Be happy.

    Anyway, back to New Reno. The fact that it's divided into territories controlled by gangs are not surprising, as it's a classical development in human history. Without Chosen One meddling, they would continue right along in an easy truce (FNV established Wright control as canon ending, with no massacre happen http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_2_endings#New_Reno).

    As for Languorous_Maiar, just keep posting, chap. You are your own worst enemy and critic, i dont have to do a damn thing.
     
  4. Languorous_Maiar

    Languorous_Maiar A Smooth-Skin

    688
    Oct 25, 2011
    At least, I know lore, without doing fallout faux pas in every post.
     
  5. laclongquan

    laclongquan Boned Hunter of Sister

    561
    Jan 11, 2008
    Dont know lore wont kill me. Worst case, it just mean my theory become groundless and I will concede the point. Going illogical like you had done will certainly kill your theories faster than anything else.
     
  6. Languorous_Maiar

    Languorous_Maiar A Smooth-Skin

    688
    Oct 25, 2011
    Well, it weren't theories, but facts confirmed by developers.
     
  7. laclongquan

    laclongquan Boned Hunter of Sister

    561
    Jan 11, 2008
    what happen if later on, in the newest sequel, the devs will make game details that contrast their earlier statement? Which will be more valid, the sayings, or the actual game files?

    I am busy enough to invent reasons for covering plot holes in actual game files. I have no energy left to cover for what they *say*.
     
  8. Languorous_Maiar

    Languorous_Maiar A Smooth-Skin

    688
    Oct 25, 2011
    Second game would be over some words... but hey, according to Fallout 1/2 ghouls came from FEV/radiation, but now, by Fallout Tactics/3/New Vegas era, it's fact that ghouls are coming just from radiation.

    So everthing newer will be more valid in determining canon things.
     
  9. laclongquan

    laclongquan Boned Hunter of Sister

    561
    Jan 11, 2008
    See that? Tracking actual changes in actually implemented game files are hard enough, now you are asking me to track some devs' sayings on interviews or fan Q&A?
     
  10. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    Man, they are just asking so much from you actually paying atention to the game you are playing...
     
  11. Languorous_Maiar

    Languorous_Maiar A Smooth-Skin

    688
    Oct 25, 2011
    What? Wheres problem?
    Any newer game didn't changed intelligent mariposa super mutants into dumber ones, so I don't see problem... and I was saying about bible, so any tracking.

    But if you having problem with distinction of Horrigan and some random Enclave soldier with APA, ekhem.
     
  12. laclongquan

    laclongquan Boned Hunter of Sister

    561
    Jan 11, 2008
    Still and all, I am still unconvinced Mariposa super mutants are intelligent.
     
  13. The Dutch Ghost

    The Dutch Ghost Grouchy old man of NMA Moderator

    Jan 11, 2004
    Not all of them were, the initial groups were rather dumb but as the process was researched and refined it led eventually to Super Mutants that are as clever as humans and sometimes even smarter.

    It's the East coast population that consist almost completely of psychos and idiots.
     
  14. zrandall111

    zrandall111 First time out of the vault

    1
    Jun 23, 2015
    lol if you do play as a legion character you find out the legion are in much better shape than the NCR. The trader guy outside the fort says Arizona and New Mexico (Legion Territory) Are safer than ever and the legion actually supports trade and often trades with the citizens of the Legion as well. Then if you talk to Caesar he makes a lot of good points about the NCR's feeble attempts to replicate pre-war United States and that in this world it would be impossible to do so. So if you take the time to get to know the Legion and their goals they sound pretty reasonable (except for the slavery and the anti women's rights and all that). So yes i agree there is a underwhelming amount of things to do for the legion or legion areas in-game.
     
  15. Battlecross

    Battlecross Banned

    730
    Jun 17, 2015
    The NCR is clearly the "good guy" in New Vegas although it is expansionist and a bit corrupt. It is mostly like a pre-war government but in opposition to the Legion it is clearly the good guy.
     
  16. Moosick

    Moosick cats

    458
    Jul 8, 2015
    I'd say they're the best of the bad guys. Individually, some of them are good, but they're a corrupt, jingoistic, power-hungry force very reminiscent of the modern American political climate. They serve to make the point to the player that they're the same as what came before - stability at the cost of *actual* freedom, corporatism, and exploitation. They'd just end up repeating the past, but with fewer nukes. They're the best bet (unless you take over New Vegas and form some sort of syndicalist head-canon, but) bar House, but he's a dictator and follows the anarcho-capitalism/lower-libertarianism that Bioshock repeatedly mocked.

    :confused:
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2015
  17. Stone Cold Robert House

    Stone Cold Robert House Mojave Rattlesnake

    157
    Jul 6, 2015
    That's not really an apt comparison at all. The objectivism in Bioshock is much more about rational self-interest and capitalist freedom; Andrew Ryan set up a system where each person places themselves at the center of their own plans, to the exclusion of the rest of society and everything they tought "beneath" them (which, in Rapture's case, led to citizens rejecting simple essential job like maintenance and food processing, which is emphazised by Atlas). In the end, his attempts to establish the supposed pride and virtue of Rapture while creating a structure where vice and corruption take prominence, a culture where the idea of a collective good is neither important nor considered by citizens.

    Mr. House has a completely different plan, first because he actually has major objectives. He's not just letting the casinos make their money with no end goal, he's all about amassing resources to leave Earth. It's an escape plan for humanity, not a glorification of individual success. Just because collecting caps through gambling is the most practical way he's found to do that, doesn't mean the dynamic of Vegas is in any way similar to Rapture.
     
  18. Moosick

    Moosick cats

    458
    Jul 8, 2015
    Yeah you're right in the sense that the philosophies are different, but he still follows that very individualist independence-of-NV route, while running as a dictator. Not that his plans definitely weren't for The Greater Good, but his fundamental premise was flawed, and effectively went 'okay, bar X, you've got free reign to run your casinos as you see fit' whilst having absolute domination over the strip. Simultaneously, he kept a minimum cap level for entrance into the strip, and kept the muck out of new vegas in order to keep his decadent dreams of the old vegas, rose tinted and all, afloat and pretty.

    The way House acted, I honestly doubt his character had any interest in others but his inner circle, and he only did that because he could kill them whenever he pleased once he had the chip. He granted individual freedoms until it got in the way of his grand dream, one of distorted nostalgia reserved for (practically speaking) the rich, and I think this has some real similarities to the way Ryan acted when his dreams were averted. House was obsessed with making it independent and absolute to his vision, doing so with unwavering control (his concreting up the vault speaks volumes to that effect). Other factions come in with their own insane ideologies and he decides he's going to have to own the dam too. He's a power hungry individual and kicks a tantrum when people get in his way. that's why he's an interesting character - the lengths he goes to to save humanity by saving the strip and returning civilisation (which is full of problems, too) are what makes him worth working for if you decide to. But I don't think he cares as much about humanity as he lets on. By the time we see him in NV, he seems more interested in having figurines sit in his toyland as he sees to be fit. I'm not great at enunciating but hopefully you see what I'm getting at.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2015