Impressions thread for negative impressions

Discussion in 'Fallout 3 Discussion' started by 3rdRate, Nov 9, 2008.

  1. UniversalWolf

    UniversalWolf eaten by a grue.

    Aug 28, 2005
    Re: Just finished...What a waste of time.

    Sorry to dredge this up, but it's an excellent example of how not to argue in favor of Bethesda/"Fallout 3".

    Don't start out by insulting. It adds nothing to your argument. If it's "fair enough" that some people have "a predisposition to disliking Fallout 3," - which is your opinion, not a fact - then there's no reason to mention it.

    Accusing people of "willful ignorance" doesn't strengthen your argument. Instead, it allows people to assume you're lighting fires because you can't cite facts.
     
  2. J Marcus

    J Marcus First time out of the vault

    12
    Nov 28, 2008
    Re: Just finished...What a waste of time.

    I agree, I find it disingenuous and hypocritical to say that the people here have a predisposition to disliking Fallout 3, and also accuse us of willful ignorance. This is completely ignoring the fact that many people here played the game, invested several hours into it and found the game lacking, that in their honesty made the effort of describing their frustrations in better detail than I would have, as the OP and many others have done. I don't know if it is a deliberate insult on your part. Nobody here is going to fall for your trap dude.

    I myself really really wanted to like the game and focus on it's positive points. But whatever this game has that redeems it from the numerous faults that it has, it is few and not important elements to constitute a good RPG. There is little saving grace to this game. It is not at all a worthy successor to Fo2. Hell I share the same sentiments the others have - I wouldn't even call it a Fallout game. It is self-imposed delusion to play down the numerous faults the game has, both as a RPG game and as a FO sequel.

    I don't get why people even try to play devil's advocate for the game. What's the point? Everybody has presented good valid reasons for disliking the game. You add all those up and the sum verdict is obvious. Trying to defend a crappy game on one or two points of contention, and then having those few redeeming qualities that the game has as some sort of definitive that somehow proves the game is still great, and Bethesda has done a great job?

    Statement: The Enclave is evil
    Counter-argument: No, they are not, because A
    Therefore, the story is still good
    Therefore, the game is good

    I like open-ended freedom
    I think Fallout 3 gives me the freedom to explore and interact
    Therefore, Fallout 3 is good

    As to the latter, no the game only allows you freedom of graphically simulated physical movement and the freedom of interaction is limited. As for open-ended freedom itself, like choices and consequences, interaction with enemies other than shooting them in the head or pre-scripted sequences etc. are nil.

    These are the same arguments I see on other forums populated by FO3 fans, in particular the Bethesda forums. They know the game has faults. They know Bethesda didn't do a good job as much as they should have. But they rely on this eeny weeny bits of saving graces and delude themselves into thinking that what they paid for out of their own pockets wasn't wasted. They also depend on and eagerly wait for mods to rescue the game from the depths of obscurity. At least I can admit the ugly truth that I did waste my money and time on this piece of shit. Bethesda sure fooled me.

    Back then, when technology and resources for making games were limited, games didn't need mods. Fallout 1 and 2 certainly didn't need mods for us to enjoy the remarkable experience and fun we had playing these games. These games had bugs, nonetheless they were the whole package straight out of the box. Mods came only after the fact.

    Which brings me something that has been bothering me recently: Am I the only one who thinks that today's gamers over-reliance on mods shows how far quality and creativity of games has gone down over the past decade? Maybe it will come to the point when game developers don't have to do much of anything anymore, and simply release sandbox templates and then have the people do whatever the hell they want, similar to writers not having to write a book but instead manufacture books with nothing printed on them, like notebooks and the people have all the damn liberty they want to do with it.

    Not that I have anything against mods, but their original purpose was to enrich and extend the gaming experience, not supplant it. Maybe it has something to do with the self-interested mentality MySpace, Youtube or Facebook is unintentionally encouraging among kids these days. Too much self-interest. With the recent innovations which paved for the possibility of mods, the availability of the tools and ease of making them, and the prevalence of them maybe has contributed to the dumbing down of the quality and lack of dedication that game developers have over the games out on the market today.

    Its amazing how gaming publications are contributing to this problem. I wondered if I was living in some fucked up parallel universe when I saw the overwhelmingly positive reviews for Fallout 3 with perfect scores and all that bullshit. A rating between 5 or 7 would have been reasonable.
     
  3. Corvin

    Corvin It Wandered In From the Wastes

    137
    Nov 17, 2008
    If your analysis is that nobody can possibly disagree with you, J, yet people disagree with you, maybe there's something wrong with your analysis.

    I don't call this a great game. I think it is a decent game. I don't compare it solely to Fallout 1 and 2. I find that irrational. I compare it to other things on the market currently.

    I dislike the main quest. I dislike some of the arbitrary limits placed on being amoral in the game. I've enjoyed a number of the sidequests (though a few of them are mind numbingly stupid). I wish the books were actually books. I wish some more savage/adult things were allowed (GTA would go there) but I also recognize the pesky moral limits placed by the retail industry and ratings boards on 3dish gaming.

    I don't play games towards finding fault with them. I play games towards me enjoying them. I've had a great time wandering the Wastes. I've had a great time not using fast travel. Sure, I've applied some mods, but I consider it on the level of people using cheat codes. If it is going to expand your enjoyment of something, why not?

    I love chatting with my younger sister about this game and I love that she got interested in it enough to play Fallout 1 and 2. I love the fact that my roommates, guys who wouldn't normally look anything RPG like in the face and live for Madden and NCAA, really enjoy Fallout 3. Their enjoyment in 'going all Mad Max' is pretty entertaining. One of them's started talking about what he'd do if the Apocalypse came.

    Ultimately what I liked about Fallout 1 and 2 was the feel, the dialogue, and what you were able to do. The system part of it was relatively forgettable. I like the feel of Fallout 3. The dialogue could use help... but in the grand scheme of things that is ultimately fixable, as are the system and what you can do with it. I wish the game was a 10... but I didn't actually expect it to be. As a 7 it isn't worth all the scorn that you and others heap on it. It isn't a 10...but it isn't the 3 or 4 of BOS. That's a huge step up for me.
     
  4. Blue_Rogue

    Blue_Rogue First time out of the vault

    1
    Nov 19, 2006
    After looking through numerous posts, I thought I might share mine here (Seemed appropriate)

    Like you said lmoa, after waiting years for this to come, the first thing that hit me (and I'm still HIGHLY disappointed), no intro...

    "War, war never changes......"

    :(

    Hell, I start fallout 1 and 2, just to listen to the intro story.
     
  5. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    why is it irrationial to compare the sequel to the past games? Seriously. And oppinions aside, just about facts. I know one might not "like" to see it compared but as said why should it not been done?
     
  6. Corvin

    Corvin It Wandered In From the Wastes

    137
    Nov 17, 2008
    10 years is eternity in gaming. Even if you're blind to the advantages it is a very different world.

    ...and the 'facts' line? Don't tell me you haven't thrown out quite a lot of opinion.
     
  7. Gentlemen

    Gentlemen Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    384
    Sep 24, 2008
    Re: Thread where people burn Fallout 3

     
  8. Idiotfool

    Idiotfool Still Mildly Glowing

    220
    Apr 12, 2007
    Here are some of my complaints with the game:

    VATS: Some people say it gives them an unfair advantage; this isn't the case, normally, for me. Although it's nice to shoot and not take damage, I seem to hit a lot harder when I'm in control of my character. Despite the fact that he has a 90 in small arms and my being 2 feet away, I can't one-shot enemies with headshots using a combat shotgun in VATS, but I can if I am actually doing the aiming. The screwed up thing is that I suck with FPS games and am using a mouse hooked up to another computer networked to this one using "Input Director". I really shouldn't pwn shit in FPS mode.

    Supermutants: Chumps. I beat them senseless with their own nailboards

    Power-Armor: I have to join the BoS to figure out how to wear armor? This was total bullshit. How do I know how to use and reload a Plasma rifle, which are the sole property of the Enclave? How do I know how to disarm fucking MINES? I guarantee that wasn't in the training learned in my days at Vault 101. After wandering the wastes until about level 10 and not seeing any real increase in itemization, I decided I wanted power armor and skipped through main quest objectives until I joined BoS. The already unenjoyable game became total shit, here, because of the story.

    Dialog: Generally, dialog was awful. When I was rushed out of the vault, the Overseer's daughter SPECIFICALLY told me to tell Dad she was sorry for everything. Including Jonas' death. When I meet dad and he asks, bewildered, why I wasn't in the vault anymore I have no option to tell him that the Overseer went insane. That's... sort of a big reason. Instead, it was something like "I was worried" or "The vault wasn't for me." Fucking juvenile writing and lacking any REAL impact on the story.

    Ending: I don't know how many of you tried to run into the area where the GECK was while using power armor (of which, the radiation resistance garnered is almost nil) but the radiation here was far higher than it was at the purity center. If Fawkes could walk around unhurt in that area, why couldn't it do the same for turning on the purity machine?
     
  9. Shattering Fast

    Shattering Fast First time out of the vault

    83
    Dec 6, 2008
    With all due respect, this is a fallacy. You can in fact be damaged while shooting in VATS. The only unfair advantage VATS provides (and it is unfair) are instant headshots.
     
  10. Kwiz

    Kwiz First time out of the vault

    6
    Jun 16, 2007
    First off, I was looking forward to buying this game right after my exams where done. A lot. FUCK!!! I didn't care about what all the ppl trapped in their captivity of negativity thought about it, I knew I was gonna enjoy it. (I kinda liked oblivion for a while).

    I'm just so extremly dissapointed. Because of my tiny laptop I had to buy it for PS3, but I don't know if that makes any difference. I came to Megaton before quitting the game.

    $100 well spent. LOL.

    edit: and an additional LOL for you caring enough to remove my ability to express myself the way I want to. What's next ppl?
     
  11. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Apr 3, 2003
    We don't remove anything. We have word filters to encourage people to write properly.

    10% damage, that is.
     
  12. Alphadrop

    Alphadrop A right proper chap.

    Aug 21, 2008
    So only taking 10% (ish) damage in VATs isn't unfair?
    Had to download a mod so I actually took any meaningfull damage when using VATS.

    Edit: Curses, beaten to it again.
     
  13. Public

    Public Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    May 18, 2006
    Burn Fallout 3!
     
  14. danielje

    danielje First time out of the vault

    54
    Mar 24, 2006
    Nothing can compare FO3, to the old fallout's. The writing is different and the direction is different.

    The games just arent comparable. I just hope Interplay can reassemble the team and create a worthy heir to the fallout name in Fallout Online.
     
  15. TheRatKing

    TheRatKing Vault Dweller

    702
    Oct 7, 2008
    Ok, TWO real towns. How many towns did Fallout have? How many towns did Fallout 2 have?

    Then Beth's wait/sleep system is inherently flawed. Why didn't they simply use the old Fallout model, which worked perfectly?

    That really isn't that hard to program, I don't think. Dues Ex had baddies that could shoot from the top of a metal grate platform to someone below (IIRC).

    Maybe the developers did this because they were lazy? I mean, they did invent EEP-FEV, so it was their call.

    I personally haven't explored those two locations yet, but so many more landmarks have been remarkable boring. Critter killing gets old quickly.

    Plenty of games have main quest characters killable. There really isn't that much challenge in making alternative methods of finding information. E.g. In Arcanum, you can kill Gilbert Bates, a very important NPC, you can then loot his diary from a locked cabinet, giving clues on how to move on.
     
  16. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    Re: Thread where people burn Fallout 3

    That is not true. There are a lot of invisible NPCs in Fallout 3. Alone in the main hall of Rivet City you have at least 2. Then count all the kidz to it and you have a damn lot of "invisible NPCs". Same to the Citadel there you hav as well a few invincible NPCs NOT tied to your main quest.

    (what is really funny though is that you can KILL EVERYTHING and whipe out the whole citatedl ... and 3-4 days later they still offer you help ... awesome bethesdian logic.)
     
  17. cratchety ol joe

    cratchety ol joe Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?

    480
    Sep 2, 2008
    too add to the burning pyre before our hate-filled glittering gem like eyes...

    I made a char, just to check something in FO3

    EN 1
    ST 1
    INT 1

    being that I couldn't make a purely 1 stat char, i spread the points in the rest, and tagged shitty skills.

    And my test, I went straight to Springvale school, and yes, yes I can still kill everything with easy (game on 'hard')

    to the point wherein my EN 1 char stood in front of a combat shotgun wielding raider and punched him to death.

    This helped satisfy one thing in my mind, I hate this game more now, the fun of exploring/critter killing is fading fast, and the glaring SHIT that is the game is now shining brightly.
     
  18. Commiered

    Commiered It Wandered In From the Wastes

    194
    Nov 17, 2008
    Interplay tend to screw up badly. How they could fall apart while having Black Isle on board I'll never know. They also had the best space sim franchise with Freespace and pissed that up as well.

    Besides getting a quest to kill 20 radscorpions in location X and returning for a reward before getting another respawning quest to kill 10 supermutants at location Y while passing hordes of other questing PC's all over the wastes is not exactly how I would imagine a Fallout game to be.
     
  19. Ausdoerrt

    Ausdoerrt I should set a custom tit

    Oct 28, 2008
    w00t, awesome, I have not been daring enough to make a STR1 character, cause it's the only stat that matters! But, I guess not so much really... Guess the stat sheet is just there for show. I knew that the skills were useless when I killed a Behemoth with a 10mm with 24 in small guns, but it's worse than that, huh.
     
  20. k9wazere

    k9wazere It Wandered In From the Wastes

    134
    Nov 20, 2008
    Re: Thread where people burn Fallout 3

    You mean "invincible". You had me confused for a second there.