Gun Control

TheGM said:
you'd only get stabed like 5 times in that time. where is the risk?
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Naw man, protected groups now essentially require the officer to be hurt before defending themselves.

Oh yea, if an attack is legit happening then cops STILL cannot shoot because they claim the perp was mentally impaired.

The safest way is to let someone get hurt FIRST before doing something otherwise its racism.

You might get fired for incompetence but at least you don't go to jail for murder.
 
Are the people that say gun laws don't keep bad guys from getting guns the same people that want tighter voting laws to keep the cheaters out?
Asking for a friend.
 


Don't think gun control would do anything here since this is more of a fluke. they broke into a house and got two shotguns, handgun and an ak-47.
How do we feel about the media showing this kids face? Apparently they were excited to reenact GTA.
 
Morgan_ said:
Don't think gun control would do anything here since this is more of a fluke. they broke into a house and got two shotguns, handgun and an ak-47.
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Well it is worth noting that pretty much all guns used in violent crimes were at one point purchased legally before falling into the black market, either because their buyer intended to traffic them or because they were stolen (as they were in this instance).

To give an example of how this fact plays into the whole gun control conversation, many of the so-called "gun free cities" that lazy conservatives use as the penultimate example of why gun-control wouldn't work are within hours of places where firearms can be acquired relatively easily through legal means and then trafficked up the highway into the city where they are sold.
 
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Dayglow Drifter said:
Well it is worth noting that pretty much all guns used in violent crimes were at one point purchased legally before falling into the black market, either because their buyer intended to traffic them or because they were stolen.

To give an example of how this fact plays into the whole gun control conversation, many of the so-called "gun free cities" that lazy conservatives use as the penultimate example of why gun-control wouldn't work are within hours of places where firearms can be acquired relatively easily through legal means and then trafficked up the highway into the city where they are sold.
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Hmm, good point actually. Best solution I can think of for it is how Switzerland regulates theirs. Seems like it wouldn't be too hard to get going here.
 
I don't really have a particularly firm stance either way on gun control personally, I can see the merits in both the argument being made practically by liberals and the argument being made philosophically by conservatives.

But I will say that the bad arguments on the right-wing side vastly outweigh the bad arguments on the liberal side, and I've found that the liberal standpoint tends to be the one that actually engages with facts and reality.
 
Morgan_ said:


Don't think gun control would do anything here since this is more of a fluke. they broke into a house and got two shotguns, handgun and an ak-47.
How do we feel about the media showing this kids face? Apparently they were excited to reenact GTA.
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I could care less about them showing the kid’s face, with any luck GTA boy will have karma come back around.

I’m more concerned about the shitty firearm storage of the house he broke into. Shamefur dispray.
Dayglow Drifter said:
I don't really have a particularly firm stance either way on gun control personally, I can see the merits in both the argument being made practically by liberals and the argument being made philosophically by conservatives.

But I will say that the bad arguments on the right-wing side vastly outweigh the bad arguments on the liberal side, and I've found that the liberal standpoint tends to be the one that actually engages with facts and reality.
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I’m not even going to touch that piece of Liberal dicksucking, aside from saying that I wouldn’t call “HAVE HEART SAVE KIDS” a logical standpoint. At the end of the day, you either don’t care or you’re a bleeding heart. What goes around comes around, and the wicked will get theirs.

I’m not a bleeding heart solely because guns will be trafficked from countries like Mexico even if they’re banned completely here. And if you don’t believe that’s possible, remember that even shithole Somalia can afford secondhand Soviet rifles to arm their pirates.
 
KingArthur said:
I wouldn’t call “HAVE HEART SAVE KIDS” a logical standpoint.
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I wouldn't either but I guess what I'm saying is that the liberal argument probably makes more logical sense overall, even though I don't know if I necessarily agree with it.

KingArthur said:
guns will be trafficked from countries like Mexico even if they’re banned completely here.
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This is an interesting thing to bring up and I'm glad you did.

Because yes, obviously if guns are banned in the United States there would reasonably be a market of some size for firearms on the black market. You see this in European nations where guns are difficult to get but come larger criminal syndicates (Commorah, N'dragheta, etc) are able to get them, though it's worth noting that you don't really see guns used in street crime nearly as much in those countries.

However the situation now has guns so plentiful in the United States that not only are most guns which are used domestically in the commission of crimes former legal purchases, but organized crime groups in Mexico are literally trafficking weapons from the United States because it's cheaper and easier to do.

This huge weapons trafficking pipeline that flows through Mexico into the United States doesn't really exist.
 
Dayglow Drifter said:
I wouldn't either but I guess what I'm saying is that the liberal argument probably makes more logical sense overall, even though I don't know if I necessarily agree with it.



This is an interesting thing to bring up and I'm glad you did.

Because yes, obviously if guns are banned in the United States there would reasonably be a market of some size for firearms on the black market. You see this in European nations where guns are difficult to get but come larger criminal syndicates (Commorah, N'dragheta, etc) are able to get them, though it's worth noting that you don't really see guns used in street crime nearly as much in those countries.

However the situation now has guns so plentiful in the United States that not only are most guns which are used domestically in the commission of crimes former legal purchases, but organized crime groups in Mexico are literally trafficking weapons from the United States because it's cheaper and easier to do.

This huge weapons trafficking pipeline that flows through Mexico into the United States doesn't really exist.
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I do think you have a point there; in my eyes, it depends on who’s in office in America. Drugs and guns seem to do better the more you fight them, or at the very least more problems and loopholes arise.

*glares angrily at War on Drugs*
 
KingArthur said:
I do think you have a point there; in my eyes, it depends on who’s in office in America. Drugs and guns seem to do better the more you fight them, or at the very least more problems and loopholes arise.

*glares angrily at War on Drugs*
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I'm not supportive of the Drug War or the "War on Guns" or whatever, in both cases the overall purpose is to slap extra felonies onto largely poor and often non-white defendants in American courts.

However I will say just based on the nature of the product gun trafficking is significantly easier to police than drug trafficking is just on account for the market of illegal guns being lower and more elastic.

It's also worth noting that these two issues are generally pretty closely intertwined with one another.
 
Yeah, guys, that's why Europe has lower crime than some places in the US. It is the harder access to firearms...totally.
 
Morgan_ said:
Hmm, good point actually. Best solution I can think of for it is how Switzerland regulates theirs. Seems like it wouldn't be too hard to get going here.
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Switzerland regulates their guns by ... not having as much poverty and social unrest like the United States. Switzerland is probably one of those countries with the highest standard of living. So yeah. That would be too hard to implement.

TheGM said:
Yeah, guys, that's why Europe has lower crime than some places in the US. It is the harder access to firearms...totally.
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Well it's not the only reason. Many countries in europe have also better social safety nets, easier access to health care, education and social mobility. Particularly when you look and compare the way how psychological issues are treated in the US and for example Germany, Switzerland or France. While it is very complicated to compare the countries here I would make the point that a "nanny state" we simply call it welfare state can make a decent job of lowering crime all together.

But yeah more difficult access to guns does lower the use of guns used in crime as there are less guns around. That should be kinda self evident. What ever if you like this fact or not is a whole different issue all together. Nations like Germany or France don't have the same kind of gun culture like the United States where weapons are seen as part of their religion (Mandalorian music playing). I mean as part of the constitution. So that makes things more complicated for sure.
 
KingArthur said:
with any luck GTA boy will have karma come back around.
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TheGM said:
Yeah, guys, that's why Europe has lower crime than some places in the US. It is the harder access to firearms...totally.
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I actually never said that they have lower rates of crime, just that guns tend to be involved in violent crime way less than they are here in the United States.
 
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